bluefan18

Sun, Jan 2, 2011 : 8:50 p.m.

Wouldn't be great if David Brandon pulled a wild card out of his sleeve and announced next week the hiring of Urban Meyer. He always wanted to come back to the Midwest, probably wont happenbut it sure would "shock the world".

scott

Sun, Jan 2, 2011 : 2:33 p.m.

Missionbrazil I appreciate your opinion and i also appreciate you not being an A-hole to prove it like so many other people. I know this is an old blog you may get this you may not but none the less. I agree with you that JH is an impressive coach and he could have great success at M. But with the nature of college football and the state of this team i see it taking time for him to put a M caliber team on the feild. I dont think the fan base or the university have the patience to go through 3 down years therefore i believe he isnt the right fit. timing isnt right. i may be wrong or may be right only the future will tell. If he is hired i hope im wrong and would love to be wrong i just think it is important to think about that senario.

PeteM

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 4 p.m.

Brian Cook's latest mgoblog post makes the point that a 2-3 week coaching search is out of the question at this point since it would destroy the recruiting class (and by doing that doom the next hire): http://mgoblog.com/content/one-last-blind-stab-dark#comments I tend to agree. I'm not sure when the right time is to fire a coach, but Brian usually knows what he is talking about. This calls into the question the idea that Michigan has options other than Harbaugh or, possibly, Hoke.

Larry Weisenthal

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 1:53 p.m.

Someone else pointed out that Harbaugh has 5 kids and probably wouldn't want a pro job. It made sense to me, also, that he might want to raise his kids in the relatively wholesome environment of Ann Arbor, where he could go to their sports games easily, etc. But then I read more about Harbaugh's marital history. I understand that Harbaugh has 5 kids, including one just born. I also understand that he's been married twice. I think that probably the first 4 kids were with the first wife and the most recent with his second wife. What I'd like to know is where the kids from his first marriage live. If they live somewhere in the SF Bay area, then I'd presume that this is where he'd stay.

Larry Weisenthal

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 1:51 p.m.

Someone else pointed out that Harbaugh has 5 kids and probably wouldn't want a pro job. It made sense to me, also, that he might want to raise his kids in the relatively wholesome environment of Ann Arbor, where he could go to their sports games easily, etc. But then I read more about Harbaugh's marital history. I understand that Harbaugh has 5 kids, including one just born. I also understand that he's been married twice. I think that probably the first 4 kids were with the first wife and the most recent with his second wife. What I'd like to know is where the kids from his first marriage live. If they live somewhere in the SF Bay area, then I'd presume that this is where he'd stay.

missionbrazil

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 12:55 p.m.

Some of the coaches who have won a national championship in 3 years or less: Berry Switzer 1974,75 (2nd & 3rd years) Lou Holtz 1988 (3rd year) Dennis Erickson 1989, 1991 (1st & 3rd years) Gene Stallings 1992 (3rd year) Lloyd Carr 1997 (3rd year) Bob Stoops 2000 (2nd year) Larry Coker 2001 (1st year) Larry Coker 2002 (finished 2nd - 2nd year) Jim Tressel 2002 (2nd year) Nick Saban 2003 (split NC, 4th year) Pete Carroll 2003 (split NC, 3rd year) Pete Carroll 2004 (4th year) Urban Meyer 2006, 2008 (2nd & 4th years) Nick Saban 2009 (3rd year at Alabama) Chip Kelly or Gene Chizek 2010 (2nd year)

XTR

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 11:14 a.m.

"nobody seems to be talking about the rebuilding process if JH gets hired. spread style teams dont translate to pro style teams." It will always be rebuilding even if RR is retained or not. Having a new coach however will correct the path to greatness in the future. JH went 7-4, 11-1, 11-1 at USD using a spread type of offense with a dual threat QB. JH then won over unbeatable USC in his first year without QB Luck on pure smarts and motivation. Then he went 11-1 to the BCS with QB Andrew Luck using an aggressive version of the pro style attack. My point is, not all coaches "need time to get their players to play their schemes" like RR, there are good coaches that would make the most out of the talent that they have when they took over a team. This is the reason why there are coaches who won national championships in their second and third season with players that they did not totally recruit. They win championships at the same time RR begs for "more time to get my players to play my scheme".

ChelseaBob

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 10:29 a.m.

Article from AnnArbor.com November 27th, 2011; "Up by two touchdowns late in the fourth quarter, Michigan drove the length of the field and scored on Ohio State again. Now up by 20, Harbaugh send the offense back onto the field for a two point conversion. When asked why he went for two, Harbaugh said "because we couldn't go for 3"." Good times are coming. Welcome home Jim.

townie54

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 10:02 a.m.

Let me ask you people this.If Brandon was gonna keep RR dont you think he would have announced it by now so recruits would know he would be here and the coach wouldnt be swinging in the wind?RR is a square peg trying to fit in a round hole.The only other reason to not say is if the new coach turns us down he would keep RR.But I dont think that is the case.Bye Bye RR

missionbrazil

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 9:50 a.m.

Scott "all those wins at sdsu and stanford mean nothing" You may not agree with this, but I partly agree with your statement and partly do not. JH's wins at U of SD do not necessarily demonstrate that he could coach well in the Big Ten, but his record and his turning around a pitiful program at Stanford very much demonstrates that he could be a successful BT coach. The Pac 10 is one of the top conferences in the nation, as is the BT, and if a coach can be successful in the Pac 10 it is very likely that he can be successful in the BT. (for example the Sagarin ranking for conferences has the Pac 10 at # 1 in 2010, then the SEC, then Big 12, and then the BT.) JH's record & success in the Pac 10 is more indiciative of possible success in the BT than say RR's record & success in the Big East at WVU... so far his past Big East success has not been converted into BT success. Plus the turnaround at Stanford has been very impressive. He took a 1-11 Pac 10 team with 5 straight losing seasons and a reputation as a doormat, and turned it into one of the top teams in the nation. The year before he got there the 1-11 team was rated # 118 out of # 120 in scoring offense, and # 108 in scoring defense. (they lost by an average of 3 touchdowns per game). Like I said, you may not agree with that, but I think it is sound logic.

missionbrazil

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 9:25 a.m.

RR supporters seem to want to conveniently forget that going from 9-4 to 3-9 to 5-7 to 7-5 is not progress... 9-4 to 7-5 in 3 years is not progress. RR supporters seem to want to conveniently forget that going from 6-2 & 2nd in the BT to 2-6, 1-7, and 3-5 (7th in BT) is not progress. RR supporters seem to want to conveniently forget that LC's teams won or tied for 1st in the BT 5 times and 2nd 4 times and 3rd 3 times... RR's BEST finish in 3 years is 7th... not progress. And 0 wins against BT teams with winning records and 1-13 vs OSU / PSU / Wiscy / MSU / Iowa in not progress. Technically, IF we ignore decades of success and competing for the BT championship almost every year in those decades, and IF we start with the 3-9 record in 2008, then there is progress. Both those are too big of IF's folks... reality shows there is NO progress. (I can see the next round of comments now, probably attacking LC since he is mentioned above... let's stick to commenting about RR's record at UM and in the BT shall we?)

Bluewolverine

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 9:15 a.m.

It is really nice to see spirited opinion about the possible change at the head position for Michigan Football. It is very important to remember in these times of change that tradition and discipline in this program are important. What ever happens after the bowl game as far as the coaching position goes we all need to be behind Michigan tradition and personally I don't think its there right now. Jim Harbaugh or Brady Hoke are the best two candidates to bring the tradition back. Happy New Year all and lets enjoy the game.

scott

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 9:02 a.m.

nobody seems to be talking about the rebuilding process if JH gets hired. spread style teams dont translate to pro style teams. Everyone seems to look at the fact that he is a "michigan man" and that somehow makes him great. The truth is IF, he gets hired he hasn't won 1 game at UM he lost out on this year in recruiting and he inherits a team doesn't fit. all those wins at sdsu and stanford mean nothing. There is an excellent chance he takes this team with all the transfers that leave if RR is fired and goes 3-9 4-8. Sure he has a track record and he might be great in 3-4 seasons but is that what we really want? another rebuilding process and a 3-4 year plan? Truthfully RR should get one more year, switch things up defensively and see if this comes full circle or if coaching change needs to happen now find someone that fits and can win now not 3-4 seasons.

XTR

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 7:50 a.m.

"Heartbreak... what was Harbaughs "impressive, really turning things around" record at Stanford last year, in his third year? Oh right, 8-5, 3 games better than the year before. Guess what our record will be should we win the bowl game..." Comparing Stanford to Michigan again. Football program wise, they are not the same. RR took over a high profile winning program and made it under average while JH came on a Pac 10 doormat and made it Top Ten. It is like making Indiana a Top Ten team and go to the BCS in 4 years.

XTR

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 7:46 a.m.

"I find it funny that when people try to refute the idea that RR will win 9+ games next year, they cite his OVERALL record over the last 3 years as "proof"... They conveniently ignore the fact he has progressed by 2 games/year each year." 7 close wins and 5 big losses is the record this year. The close wins against Illinois and Purdue were the close additional wins this year. In the 5 big losses against MSU, Iowa, PSU, Wisconsin and Ohio State, who do you beat next year? RR's performance goes sideways from here, playing to 5-7 and 7-5.

Joseph Edwards

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 7:19 a.m.

...the same coaching merry-go-round that Nebraska appears to be on now (1998 to today: Solich - Callahan - Pelini -???).

Joseph Edwards

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 7:07 a.m.

I also believe RR's days are numbered and await Saint Harbaugh's turn on the Michigan coaching merry-go-round a la Alabama, 1983 to 2007 (Perkins-Curry-Stallings-DuBose-Franchione-Price-Shula). ALL ABOARD!

3 And Out

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 1:24 a.m.

when a coach tears down a program that had 40 straight non losing seasons, 33 straight bowl games....to 3-9 it is not hard to "improve" on that crappy performance. BTW, 2-6 in the Big Ten in 2008, 1-7 in 2009 and 3-5 in 2010 is hardly improvement when it counts. Keep trying though! Logic defys your illogic.

Dusty

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 1:19 a.m.

Heartbreak... what was Harbaughs "impressive, really turning things around" record at Stanford last year, in his third year? Oh right, 8-5, 3 games better than the year before. Guess what our record will be should we win the bowl game...

Dusty

Fri, Dec 31, 2010 : 1:08 a.m.

I find it funny that when people try to refute the idea that RR will win 9+ games next year, they cite his OVERALL record over the last 3 years as "proof"... They conveniently ignore the fact he has progressed by 2 games/year each year.

ohiowolverine

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 11:08 p.m.

D21, great story. Thanks. Go Blue!

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 11:05 p.m.

Stefanie, Thanks for the tip! I had first gleaned it from another forum and posted them in segments in haste in here until I found the Albom link. Meanwhile, a Happy New Year to you and the A2 staff.

heartbreakM

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:39 p.m.

Someone above, Hawaiian Neal, asks why JH was not mentioned last year. Well, in fact, Neal, JH was talked about a great deal last year as an example of a coach in his third year really turning things around and we were all amazed at how well he was doing out there, as opposed to our fine coach.

heartbreakM

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:32 p.m.

Why JH would be successful at Michigan (based on history): 1. His teams at SD and at Stanford play with determination, toughness, fundamentals, and poise. 2. He is a no-nonsense coach who gets his teams to perform the same way, yet appears to have fun. 3. He gets it, as far as the Michigan football thing (he played in it, he guaranteed victory against OSU and luckily got it, he won a B10 championship) 4. He does not look like a lost duck on the sideline 5. He has developed 2 Heisman trophy finalists at Stanford and will know how to deal with whatever talent he has

bsblue

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:12 p.m.

Hay Michigan fans, I have been reading your stuff for some time and thought I should jump in here. I would like to address the Rich Rod haters. Michigan has one of the brightest head coaches in college football and youre lucky to have him. Let me explain. Michigan football was in a steady head down situation before Rich showed up; they were quickly losing their grip on the top of the Big Ten. Let us flash back to 2007. Carr had not beaten the Buckeyes in four years with Michigan teams that were LOADED with talent. The 2007 Michigan team was full of future NFL bound players and Carr and his staff could only produce a 7-4 record. Thats bad coaching, but why. Remember Carr wanted to retire a few years before 2007 and they begged him to stay longer. Lets be honest with ourselves, coach Carrs heart and drive was gone by 2007 and the recruiting showed it. You Michigan Rich Rod haters really expected him to come in with the low talent pool Carr left and be great his first season. Carr was 7-4 with a huge pool of NFL stars. Rich had nothing to work with those first two years, but you can start to see the turn around. The offense change in one year and so can the defense. Rich Rod recruits are only in their second year. If you are smart and keep him Michigan will play for a National Title in 2012. Rich Rod never had a recruiting class ranked higher than 27th at W. Virginia and he had the squad one game away from a National Title game. Thats a great coach.

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:04 p.m.

Or you can read the story in it's entirety at this link: http://mitchalbom.com/d/journalism/787/coach-and-qbschembechler-harbaugh-have-special-relationship

tzgoblue

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:23 p.m.

Seeing the picture of "young" Jimmy Harbough coaching up Ricky Leach brought something to mind. Last year Mr. Ricky Leach was very outspoken in his total support of RR. He was all over the radio shows and doing interviews with all the writers telling anyone who would listen how great RR was for UM. I haven't heard a sound from this little mouse this year as all the speculation swirls concerning RR and his job status. Could it be our guy Leach has also jumped off the RR bandwagon and actually jumped on ship with the true intelligent long time ture blue Michigan fans that realize a loser when we see one.

tzgoblue

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:03 p.m.

GB Enjoy watching the spread in 2011 if RR is still here for the first 5 games against the weak sisters of the poor. Once the real teams start to pop up on the schedule the offense will sputter and grind to a halt as happened this year.

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:28 p.m.

3 and Out: Your last comment was the very best short summation I've read to explain why it is that Harbaugh will, indeed, be next year's Michigan Head Coach and why he is very likely to be very successful for a very long time. The whole thing fits like a kid leather driving glove. I understand that Harbaugh is currently the Vegas favorite to be the next 49ers coach. I'd personally give odds against it.

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:22 p.m.

BTW the possibility of us getting JH to come home... a point that no one seems to mention but I personally think would be very intriguing is the pipeline to the NFL that having Harbs as our coach would lead to. Imagine top recruits thinking "this is a coach who played 15 years in the league, coaches pro style and his brother is the Head Coach of one of the better teams in the NFL" Imagine the players who play for him, like for example Mike Martin...knowing that this guy has connections to the league, strong connections....and can help Martin prep for the league as well as give him strong guidance on his viability as a potential pro.... the talent level that we could get out of this possible hiring would be a significant upgrade over the namby-pamby finesse scheme that we have now with the current staff which has no connections to the league and dumb down their recruiting to only consider a certain type of player... and that goes for both sides of the ball..

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:17 p.m.

Mick...absolutely...yesterday JH was quoted as saying his mind is only split right now between his bowl game, and his new born baby... with the young'ens at home... and a challenge in front of him...its my estimation that JH stays in college....rather than deal with the massive time constrats, stress, travel and lack of control that an NFL coach has to deal with....

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:16 p.m.

jalittle, earlier you wrote the following: ""Anyway, whether you like RR or not, given time, he will win more games. Period. Non debatable. All the major players are coming back for 2011 and he would win 8-10 games next year. BUT, he could win the Big Ten title..." And my response: He will win more games. Period. Non debatable? I would say that it is totally debatable, based on his RECORD and his performance in 3 years time. 15-21 and 6-18 BT is proof that RR will win? 6-18 in the BT is a MAJOR FAILURE (.250 percentage), considering every coach before him in the last 40+ years had at least a.775 winning percentage in the conference. now you wrote ""MissionBrazil, If you want only facts, let's do it.", and then you started talking about Hoke, LC, and Bo. How is that relevant to what we were talking about, which is RR's poor overall record and his poor 6-18 BT record? Typical RR Kool-Aid stuff... you can't defend RR's record or bring up any facts or stats to refute the FACT that RR has a poor record at UM and in the BT, so you try to bring down others (including those who disagree with you). "let's put this "Hire anyone/RR has to go/Hire Hoke" nonsense to rest. Everyone knows you can make "facts" say whatever you want them to say." I never said we should hire Hoke. For sure I did say I believe it is time for RR to go, based on a poor 15-21 & 6-18 BT record, plus NCAA violations,... Please give me some FACTS that say RR has a good overall record AT UM or in the BT, or even against OSU or MSU or Wiscy or Iowa or PSU (or any decent BT team). Can you give us some facts that can say that?

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:13 p.m.

To the valiant but doomed TheoCCXII (212), Sir, the most pressing question we are inquiring of you is what will you do when your imposter king is dethroned by Cardinal Brandonichlieu in a short time in favor of Crown Prince Harbaugh. Crown Prince Harbaugh wishes to know if you would like to serve under him as a master scribe which shall be your redemption after the ghastly support of the imposter king. TheoCCXII, We await your glorious poetic answer.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:07 p.m.

Dusty, you mean like we've been consistantly manhandled in the BT under RR. Why are you so snippy w/people. Try to show a little respect. The guy you support, RR, has sucked pretty much, period. That's a fact right? If JH came to AA, he won't wanna leave because he'll be a great success I feel and it will become too much fun for him to go to the rigors of the fickle NFL. Additionally, 3 & Out, whom I respect greatly on this forum, has adeptly stated that JH w/a newly born child, his 5th btw, won't wanna spend 70-80 hrs a week coaching in the NFL.

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:04 p.m.

Mick, Thanks! Even if Harbaugh choose to go elsewhere or stay put at Stanford, any other candidate is better than having RR stay another year at UM. Also, those RR supporters usually present nothing but the same type of illogical argument to convince us that 2+2=5 is correct. Nostradamus said it best with his hidden maize n blue quatrain: A new king shall enter the land of maize and blue, For it was rife with nothing but grief and sorrow, All the evil work from RR and his minions in vain, King Harbaugh and his Court shall reign forevermore in A2.

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:04 p.m.

Dusty asks: "Larry, what exactly does his speech have to do with anything at all?" That Harbaugh meant what he said about "comin' after" Michigan. As far as Michigan being "handled," yes, I was there. Big 10 teams have long sucked in the Rose Bowl. Among other things, that particular year, was the fact that it was effectively a home game for USC and USC's regular season ended two weeks after Michigan's, with Michigan not playing between November 18 and January 1 (or close to a month and a half. In the future, Big 10 champions will finish their seasons at the same time as the Pac 12 teams, and I expect that their Rose Bowl records will improve.

Dusty

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:51 p.m.

Larry, what exactly does his speech have to do with anything at all? And for the record, we lost that game by 14 and the game wasn't as close as the final score. We were handled.

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:40 p.m.

To Dusty: So you didn't see the same thing that I saw this season? The number one Michigan play being the Denard Robinson "designed run." Which fooled UConn and ND, but which the quality defenses learned to expect, with the result being that Robinson got creamed, again and again. And knocked out of game after game. And became less effective, the more he got knocked out. And this is supposed to be a sustainable offense? I had the privilege of attending the pre-Rose Bowl Michigan pep rally on the Santa Monica Pier, in late December, 2006, right before the M-USC Rose Bowl. The most inspirational speech, by far, was that given by Jim Harbaugh, who had just finished a successful coaching stint at the University of San Diego and was on his way to Stanford. Among other things, he told the Michigan players (at the pep rally) that USC didn't respect them and it was up to them to prove USC wrong. There was other good, fiery stuff (I shot a video and put it on the Internet, but took it down, after the loss). What I liked most about Harbaugh's speech was the closing. He was off to Stanford, Harbaugh said. For this game, Harbaugh said that he'd be solidly Blue, but, after this, he'd be "comin' after ya' " At that time (just before New Year's Day, 2007), I fully expected to see Harbaugh's future Stanford teams playing Michigan in the Rose Bowl. Well, Harbaugh showed up, but Michigan didn't come close.

Dusty

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:33 p.m.

Actually, I take back my earlier comment. Harbaugh coming then bailing in a few years isn't the worst thing that could happen. The worst thing would be Rich Rod is fired, Harbaugh goes to the NFL next year, and Michigan hires Brady Hoke. So we go from a coach who dominated the Big East to a coach who managed all of 3 winning seasons (out of 8) in the MAC and MWC.

Dusty

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:25 p.m.

3 and Out... uh, no. Devin won't be playing, even if Denard is injured on the first play of the game and can't return. Nice to see people who actually follow Michigan football making comments... /sarcasm

Dusty

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:24 p.m.

Oh, and Larry: stop trying to compare the college game to the NFL. It's a different game, period. You don't use players the same way. What is successful at one level isn't necessarily what will be successful at the other. So no, you don't use Denard at Michigan like you'd use Vick in Philly. For many, many reasons.

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:24 p.m.

1bit....well...if/when D Rob goes out with an injury, as he has in about 9 games so far this year...that would mean Devin Gardner coming in... and his 'medical redshirt' shot would be officially done at that point... oh well, I like Devin a lot and maybe he can showcase his skills for JH...

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:14 p.m.

To Dusty: The worst thing that could happen would be for Harbaugh to come in and have instant success and give Michigan 4 strong years and then leave? That's a high class problem that I, for one, would gladly take. Sure beats the alternative of being Big 10 dormats for the same period of time.

scott

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:10 p.m.

Ben Genius. Your spot on.

Dusty

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:07 p.m.

The absolute worst thing that could happen would be Harbaugh taking the job at Michigan, having instant success at Michigan with Rich Rod's players, then using that faux-success to land an NFL job in 3-4 years... leaving Michigan to look for a new coach yet again. I really don't think it's a good idea to fire a coach to go for a guy who is likely going to leave in the not-so-distant future.

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:06 p.m.

To Amzak: Total point differential is relevant, for the following reason. If the point differential was the same between year 1 and year 3 (which it was), then the fact that Michigan scored more points on offense may simply be explained by the fact that the opposition also scored more points on their (collective) offense, got a big lead (which they did) and relaxed on defense, allowing Michigan the opportunity to put up more points, while still maintaining their comfortable leads. Aggregate point differential is certainly relevant, as it provides an index of general performance, over multiple opponents. I don't know how you can point to any tangible improvement at all. There was a single quality win all year, over a single quality opponent (U Conn) and that was in game #1, before anyone had the chance to adjust to DRob (the one dimensional offensive threat, who was -- predictably -- beat into the ground with injuries (including a probably concussion). If DRob is forced to play the same role for the next two years, he risks a devastating, career-ending injury. As I watched DRob on the receiving end of tackles, as the year wore on, it looked for all the world as if the defenses were literally trying to knock him out of the game. Defenses tend to do this for all one man team QBs, but the RR school of how to mistreat the QB makes it inevitable that defenses will succeed with their knock out strategies. I don't find anything at all about RR's supposedly vaunted offense to be praiseworthy, nor even sustainable. If you want a model of how to utilize at talent like DRob's, look to the present example of the Eagles with Michael Vick. That's what I think Harbaugh will do next year and DRob will be more effective, because he'll stay in games and not get his bell rung, the way it was this year.

scott

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:03 p.m.

Can someone explain why JH is going to be this awesome coach? I haven't heard one good reason yet. Being a "Michigan man" guarantees you nothing. Being the hottest name in football guarantees you nothing.(Ask notre dame. How many big names have they hired? When is the last time they were relevent?) He runs a completely different style of offense and defense. The writing is on the wall. Hiring JH = 3-4 years of rebuilding. I'm not saying RR is the guy but seriously if we are going to make a change make a smart one.

jalittle12

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:02 p.m.

MissionBrazil, If you want only facts, let's do it. Future candidate Brady Hoke's overall record: 47-50 Loyd Carr's Versus Ohio St: Lost 6 out of his last 7 games (scored 3 points versus Ohio St in his last season (2006) with 6 future NFL players on offense alone. LOL!) And you want to talk about only scoring 10 this year...... LC's Bowl Record: 6-7 LC Lost 4 our of his last 5 bowl games (last win, again, was with 6 future NFL players on offense.) Bo Schembechler: Born in Ohio, played in Ohio, and first coached at Ohio St. Schem's Bowl Record: 5-12 Lost his first 7 BOWL GAMES Lost his first 10 out of 12 BOWL GAMES Never won a National Championship Sure did win a lot of games....... So was Bo a bad coach? NO. Was LC a bad coach? NO. Come on man, you can make "stats" say whatever you want them to say. I love Michigan as much as you do, but RR has had 3 years. Put that into perspective. Has he made mistakes, absolutely! Is our defense horrific, yes sir! But can he improve and put together a winner, with time, I believe so. Just stop and think for a second....We are playing on New Years Day, with a chance to go 8-5 with a predominately Fresh through Junior squad. Hello?! With that all being said, I still believe Harbs deal is done and he is coming. AND, I'm all for it, but let's put this "Hire anyone/RR has to go/Hire Hoke" nonsense to rest. Everyone knows you can make "facts" say whatever you want them to say.

The Ben

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7 p.m.

The sense that I'm getting from people on here is that a team with tons of injuries, an inexperienced offense, and 8 (EIGHT!) true freshmen contributing on defense has absolutely zero chance of vastly improving next season with RichRod as coach. That, my friends, is a strange position to take. Unless you are trying to justify firing a guy that you don't like, and hiring one that you do like. In that case, just come out and say it. Stop pretending that a team of true freshman and sophomores is a hopeless case for future seasons. Anyone who follows sports knows that there are major surprises every year. Teams come out of nowhere, with low expectations, and have amazing seasons. I can't think of a team that is more set up for something like that then UM. None of you KNOW FOR CERTAIN that Michigan won't come out, right the ship, and blow the doors off the Big Ten next season.

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:59 p.m.

Hey 1bit is that true about TForce being inelligible? hope not... Regarding this game, we really dont know much about MSU other than they have a good coach (not that MSU, the other one down south).... and Im really not sure how this game is going to play out... MSU could end up being = to a weaker Big Ten team, or a stronger Big Ten Team we just dont know... either way I do believe that they will be a tough opponent for this particular Michigan team to play

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:57 p.m.

LW "Also, I think that Harbaugh thrives when he's got a blood enemy villain with which to do battle. He made one out of Pete Carroll, but imagine him going out to slay the OSU Buckeye dragon, after so many years of Tressel domination." Love that... "imagine him going out to slay the OSU Buckeye dragon, after so many years of Tressel domination."... I can totally imagine JH going in with that mindset and then getting it done.

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:39 p.m.

Syracuse just beat KSU to win their bowl game. So RR 'trading' Scott Shafer for GERG? Syracuse won that trade, lol.

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:31 p.m.

amzack "missionbrazil: re-read my comment. You are only using RR's 3 seasons at Michigan to describe his coaching success/capability compared to Bump's 10 seasons. RR's overall is 58% (yes, not great factoring the last 3 years), but RR is.580 compared to Bump's.500 Amzack, I can see that you are an RR supporter who just won't be realistic and acknowledge that RR's record at UM is terrible. And given the great winning tradition that we have at UM and the great success we have had in the BT, RR's record looks even worse. By the way, Bump's overall MICHIGAN winning percentage is.547 and RR's is.417, and Bump's BT percentage is.485 and RR's is.250 (and Bump's is the worst one other than RR in over 80 years). "There's the stats you are looking for. I appreciate opposing views - just keep comparisons relevant." The ONLY relevant record is RR's record AT UM and in the BT. We don't really care what he did at Glennville State or in the Big East at WVU. The Big Ten is not the Big East. Only his 6-18 record is relevant here, no matter how hard you try to say otherwise. "taking my comments out of context and then arguing against them is very odd... I guess those of us who think RR should get his 4th year - including Mike Riley, HC at Oregon State - just don't know as much as you." Saying those types of things like "taking my comments out of context" and "just don't know as much as you" does not help your argument, but rather brings it down a level or two. Do you really need to say things like that?

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:30 p.m.

Larry Weisenthal: The arguement was in regards to Michigan's offensive improvement (and effectiveness) against better B10 teams. The examples I mentioned were provided to show that Michigan's offense could put up enough points and rack up yards against those teams. Statistics referencing total points scored of other B10 teams is not relevant to the topic. Using total points scored in a season is questionable data anyway - you should factor home/away, strength of schedule, youth of team, weather, grass/turf, etc.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:23 p.m.

D21, thank you kindly for the compliment and New years wishes. You sir are an excellent poster yourself and I highly regard and enjoy your commentary and insight. A very Happy New Year to you and your family my friend. I love how confident you are about the upcoming coaching change, I certainly hope you are spot on sir, Go Blue!!

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:18 p.m.

So why would Harbaugh chose Michigan over the 49ers? Well, if he wins at Michigan (as he is likely to do), he'll be a legend forever, whom they'll name buildings after, and, long before that, he'll be a living and breathing god. In then NFL, he'll be just one a 50 coaches to win a Super Bowl. San Francisco is great, in many respects, but everyone has to cope with the traffic, which takes away a lot of the fun. When Harbaugh walks the sideline in the Big House, he'll often have as many eyes on him as will be inbounds, on the field. It's an incredible thrill. Also, I think that Harbaugh thrives when he's got a blood enemy villain with which to do battle. He made one out of Pete Carroll, but imagine him going out to slay the OSU Buckeye dragon, after so many years of Tressel domination. If he wins at Michigan, he can always go to the NFL, if living in Ann Arbor becomes old. But if he goes first to the pros, there's no guarantee that the Michigan job would ever again open up, if RR's replacement is a reasonably young guy. I'm personally wagering (just for fun) that RR is out, no matter what the result of the Gator Bowl, and the Harbaugh will, indeed, be the next Michigan coach.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:15 p.m.

Who cares about what the Oregon St. coach Riley thinks. This is relevant how?

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:14 p.m.

Mick: Having a different view point on various topics does not equate to having the opintion that it was never RR's fault for any unfavorable decision he ever made.

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:10 p.m.

I am giving thanks to those pro-Michigan Men posters like XTR, Mick, EMR, RudeJude, 3 and Out and many many others for their excellent arguments. Man, I am shedding some tears of happiness and am going to sing, "Hail to the Victors", to youse all. To the pro RR kool aid drinkers, keep on singing, "You Raise Me Up" while following RR to another coaching destination. Happy Days are coming back soon. Happy New Year.

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:09 p.m.

missionbrazil: taking my comments out of context and then arguing against them is very odd. You used RR's last 3 seasons to assess his ability, and my opinion is that his overall coaching record is more indicative of his ability. I think it is best we end our exchange today. I guess those of us who think RR should get his 4th year - including Mike Riley, HC at Oregon State - just don't know as much as you. I bet I feel as disappointed in the last three years as you do. Also, I think like you do that RR made some coaching mistakes. But we differ in that I think that some of the short comings (defensive talent/performance & kicking game) were beyond RR's control - things he is addressing (we'll see more things addressed if/when he knows he is staying).

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:05 p.m.

To Amzak: Regarding Michigan's alleged improvement against the good Big 10 teams -- no. If you compare the aggregate point differential between Michigan (total points scored) and the Big 10 teams with winning records (total points scored), there's been no improvement at all in 3 years. Not a hint. The vaunted RR offense was only effective (1) against the lesser teams; (2) against the better teams only late in the game, when the opponents basically went into a soccer-style prevent mode, and (3) with DRob was healthy, which he wasn't, on account of the abuse he had to take with all of the borderline immoral QB "designated runs."

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6 p.m.

ESPN NFL analyst Adam Schefter said Thursday that he believes Stanford coach Jim Harbaugh, a former Michigan quarterback, will be the Wolverines' next head coach. Schefter told ESPN Football Today podcast host Ross Tucker, in response to a question regarding Harbaugh's interest in the vacant head coach job with the San Francisco 49ers, that Michigan is his next destination. Regarding the 49ers' interest in Harbaugh, Schefter said: "They love Jim Harbaugh. My understanding is it's going to be very difficult to get him and I don't think he'll wind up there. The sense is Jim Harbaugh will wind up at the University of Michigan. "Again, this is the buzz around the league. This is what smart people think is going to happen. That's the sense of people that I know, trust and respect that Harbaugh will not go to the Niners, that he will go to Michigan. And it will be up to another NFL team to see if it could entice him and prevent him from going to a place like Michigan. "One thing I feel certain about: Jim Harbaugh is going to leave Stanford."

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:48 p.m.

missionbrazil: re-read my comment. You are only using RR's 3 seasons at Michigan to describe his coaching success/capability compared to Bump's 10 seasons. RR's overall is 58% (yes, not great factoring the last 3 years), but RR is.580 compared to Bump's.500 There's the stats you are looking for. I appreciate opposing views - just keep comparisons relevant

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:32 p.m.

amzack "cherry picking RR's 1st three years to compare to Bump's record? Think anyone will take that flawed comparison seriously given that RR's has a history of building winning teams?" ps - I actually did not originally compare RR's BT record against Bump. I compared his 6-18 record to coaches after Bump, which made RR look even worse because every coach after Bump had a BT winning percentage of at least.775 or better, vs.250; comparing to Bump should have made you happier, because at least it's.500 vs.250 - not quite as bad.

The Ben

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:27 p.m.

"And again with how great we did offensively against Wisc, Iowa, MSU, etc. We were geting trounced, they all had big leads and that's when we made some yards and points, in games we lost BTW. This is what you're hanging your hat on?" The offense was visibly tight in the 1st quarter of every one of those games. Feeling pressure to get in the endzone on every single play is not a good place to be mentally. It's one thing for a game to evolve into a shootout. But to know all week long leading up to a game that you have to score a TD on every possession? Forget it. Say what you will about the defense, but this offense would be unstoppable with an experienced group and a solid running back. They were putting up those yards with a bunch of sophomores and no running game, other than Denard.

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:22 p.m.

XTR, others: there are plenty of great coaches out there that didn't play for Bo. If RR is gone, I sure hope DB finds the best coach he can regardless if the coach ever played or coached for Bo. Plus, that whole "Michigan Man" concept is nauseating. Bo wasn't even a Michigan Man when they hired him.

The Ben

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:21 p.m.

"Keep RichRod" people have valid reasons for wanting to see a 4th year. "Fire RichRod" people have different reasons, still valid, for wanting him gone. So... I guess that pretty much leaves the decision in David Brandon's hands. The same place as it has always been. How about we just enjoy the Gator Bowl? It'll be nice to have a game to watch on New Year's Day.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:20 p.m.

Amzack, again with excuses for RR, it seems to never be his fault for any decision made while he's been the coach. How does that work exactly? That he gets exonerated by so many of you for his flawed decisions? Pray tell. And again with how great we did offensively against Wisc, Iowa, MSU, etc. We were geting trounced, they all had big leads and that's when we made some yards and points, in games we lost BTW. This is what you're hanging your hat on? That's good enough for you for us to get our teeth kicked in, but hey we scored some points and had nice yardage totals? Really? No seriously, really?

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:14 p.m.

p.s. MSU was peaking and OSU? Well, that was just plain ugly!

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:10 p.m.

amzack "cherry picking RR's 1st three years to compare to Bump's record? Think anyone will take that flawed comparison seriously given that RR's has a history of building winning teams?" That's the 2nd time you've mentioned "cherry picking" stats. And then you do not supply any sort of stats or records to back up your comments. I know why... because you can't. How can you supply anything factual to defend a 6-18 BT record in 3 years? You can't. The ONLY history or record that matters to UM fans is RR's record at UM... Glenville State or WVU stats or records - how do those have any bearing on his Big Ten record? The only reason you want to mention those is because you have nothing positive to say about 6-18 in the BT. Also, what is "flawed" about our presentation of RR's BT record? Are we getting the facts wrong? Does he have a 6-18 BT record or are we presenting "flawed" numbers? Is he 1-13 vs OSU/PSU/Wiscy/Iowa/MSU or not? Is he winless in 3 years against teams that finish with a winning record in the BT or not? Please correct these if they are "flawed".

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5:09 p.m.

Larry Weisenthal: I think RR did make some improvement this year aside from the season record. Michigan's offense scored 28 points with 442 total yards against Wisconsin; 28 points wtih 522 total yards against Iowa; 31 points and 423 total yards against Penn State. It was the defense/special teams (as we all know) that prevented the wins against the relevant B10 teams. So, RR has successfully installed a great offense. Just think when he lands a top RB and the defense matures/tweaks.

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 5 p.m.

missionbrazil: cherry picking RR's 1st three years to compare to Bump's record? Think anyone will take that flawed comparison seriously given that RR's has a history of building winning teams? You don't think with all the returning starters and the commits so far won't continue the improvement? Mick: RR had to get rid of Shafer due to all the media, alumni, and front office pressure for a token change. I don't think it was RR. Put 7 true freshman in a 4-3 defense, and the secondary still gets burned.

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 4:54 p.m.

Take a look at this youngest coach ever, Harbaugh, coaching up a certain famous Wolverine player while Bo took a breather back in Nov 1977 against NW. A true Michigan Man coming home to coach our Wolverines: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_JrB9fpNy-yE/RrFUhHqnAyI/AAAAAAAAAQQ/pJIk9kE7Zq4/s320/77Northwestern.jpg

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 4:46 p.m.

LW "I'll add my vote to the concept that choice #1 is Harbaugh, but, if unavailable (only because of taking the 49ers job), then I'd just stick it out with RR for one more year." I agree that JH is the # 1 choice, but I am one of many who do not agree with 1 more year for RR. If JH does not come there are other good HC's that can turn things around, and do it within 2 years. "Those who think RR has made progress, based on the 7-5 record, are not looking at the most important data, which are RR's record against winning Big 10 teams and the point differential, by year, between Michigan against winning Big 10 teams. Not only is there no improvement in won-lost record against good Big 10 teams, but the losses have been just as bad, points wise." Good points. More details: * In 3 years RR has 0 wins against BT teams that finish with a winning BT record... 0 in 3 years speaks volumes. * As you said we are not even close to being competitive against the winning BT teams (lost to MSU by 17, lost to Iowa (4-4 BT) by 10, lost to PSU (4-4 BT) by 10, lost to Wiscy by 20, lost to OSU by 30) *RR has had BT records of 2-6, 1-7, and 3-5... 3 losing BT records in a row. * RR has 0 wins in 3 years against teams that have finished in the Top 25.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 4:33 p.m.

Hey Atticus, this is one mockingbird of a hire that we have to put an end to and pronto. Also, ooh look at this so far, Scott Shafer's Syracuse' DEF is holding a Big 12 team to 7 pts so, far late in the the 1st half. Amazing, another RR brilliant move.

Atticus F.

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:59 p.m.

Thats a good way of looking at it missionbrazil. Does RR have the worst record in UofM history? We must protect this house! Hey hey, ho ho, Rich Rodriguez has got to go!

Larry Weisenthal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:58 p.m.

I'll add my vote to the concept that choice #1 is Harbaugh, but, if unavailable (only because of taking the 49ers job), then I'd just stick it out with RR for one more year. Those who think RR has made progress, based on the 7-5 record, are not looking at the most important data, which are RR's record against winning Big 10 teams and the point differential, by year, between Michigan against winning Big 10 teams. Not only is there no improvement in won-lost record against good Big 10 teams, but the losses have been just as bad, points wise. What offends me most is the way RR endangered DRob's career by using him as a one man sacrificial lamb. I think that Harbaugh would retain DRob -- as a quarterback -- by pointing out how Michael Vick got to be a truly great NFL quarterback -- not with "designated runs" (which are borderline immoral, for a QB), but with read options, with a heavy emphasis on avoiding hits. Pat White couldn't make it as an NFL QB, partially at least because he was coached by RR. Harbaugh just might be able to turn DRob into an NFL-style Michael Vick. I don't think that Harbaugh would try and convince DRob to become a running back, wide receiver, or defensive back. I remember Dennis Franklin (Michigan QB in the early 1970s and brief career as an NFL wide receiver -- now a successful businessman in So Cal). Can anyone provide a brief listing of college QBs who had successful NFL careers in other positions?

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:40 p.m.

Edward V. "@missionbrazil, you can't just look back 40 years for Michigan coaches; if you go back 50 years you'll find Bump Elliott with an overall 32-34-2 conference record. (Of course Bump did win a Rose Bowl, and he was a star player at Michigan.)" I thought going back 40 years was going back far enough to make the point, but ok let's go back to Bump... he still had a near.500 BT percentage (still much better than.250). But since we can now go back 50 years, can we go back more than 70 years and include Bennie Oosterbaan (.648) and Mr. Fritz Crisler (.777)? Or if we go all the way back to 1896 the worst we'll find is one more.500 BT coach, a.560 BT coach, and all the rest are between.600 and.778 winning percentage in the BT. Anyway you look at it, Mr. Rich Rod at.250 6-18 is far below anyone else in the history of our great program.

Mike

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:32 p.m.

it would have to be harbaugh.cant beleive what im hraing after only his 2nd bowl apprence in what 9 years of coaching. brady hoke koolaide drinkers.what bowl where they in who did they play.yeah cant wait to see hoke come in and lose to msu every year and get crushed by osu.it either harbaugh or stick with rich.we might not know untill after stanfords bowl game. hoke is a joke pizza pizza bowl maybe if where lucky.harbaugh or rich.

GB

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:31 p.m.

RR deserves another year... it will be exciting to watch the spread with DR and the team in 2011. The old 3 yards and a cloud of dust is BORING. GO with RR.

Eric

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:13 p.m.

Personally if it isn't Jim Harbaugh I would stick with Rich Rodriquez and focus on a new defensive coordinator. -------- Agreed but think it is a done deal

MikeB

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:09 p.m.

Personally if it isn't Jim Harbaugh I would stick with Rich Rodriquez and focus on a new defensive coordinator.

Mick52

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:07 p.m.

Brady Hoke? The Brady Hoke from SDSU? Or is there another Brady Hoke? SDSU's Brady Hoke has an all time record as head coach of 47-50. Three winning seasons, five loosing seasons. One International Bowl (L) and one Poinsetta Bowl (W). Is this our "Michigan Man?" How is he a "very good coach?" That loosing record is "worlds away" from my idea of success. I call that a loosing record. RR career is 120-83-2 One minor bowl, Continental, four Gator bowls, one Sugar and one Fiesta. Bowl record: 2-3 w/one pending. Not so great but trumps Hoke. Better bowls. In re to JH "dissing" UM, that was not a diss, it was the truth. Bo said in re to JH at his retirement banquet, "Harbaugh, I never could get that kid to keep his mouth shut." So JH is still the JH who played here. Seems that you all know my opinion and I see I am not alone. I am with PU, Tater and Mike. I will refrain from personal attacks I think it is immature. Hard to be convinced by immature people. What I do find odd about those adamantly opposed to giving RR one more year is that none seem to ever make note that his teams are so young, particularly the last one, while the opponents that whopped Mich the worse were stocked with 4th and 5th year seniors. Never see any allowances from you folks about that. No positive comments about the best Michigan offense in modern history. JH, Hoke, whoever comes in next will likely do better with so many returning starters. If they stay and can adapt to changes.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:07 p.m.

Additionally Jim Nazium-you mean all the great three star recruits that we seem to be attracting, instead of the bevy of 4 and 5 star players that at least had M on their short list if not a commit. We are getting some 4 star, granted, but the key word here is SOME. The assumed era of dominance, which I find comical, and that RR will magically improve all facets of the team for us to be adept when he has not shown even an inkling of that!

XTR

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 3:04 p.m.

"IMO Brandon has studied Martin's fumble and will only let RichRod go if he is confident that a viable successor has been secured. My money says he secures Harbaugh or keeps RR -------------------- My money says he secured Harbaugh sometime during or just after the regular season. Everyone involved has been WAY too quiet about this." Both of them were players under Bo. They have many mutual friends that could speak for them thru back channels as early as mid season. The situation still connects like a puzzle. Wait after the bowl game for the buyout discount which would be the money to be used to buy the other buyout from the new coach. Both guys are strangely calm and that JH has yet to state that he going back to Stanford or if he is turning pro.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:58 p.m.

Let me start off with a great motto for my comment: THE LEADERS AND BEST!!!!! Let me ask everyone whom might agree(most of you) or disagree w/my assessments,have we lived up to this motto in the last 3 years? I'm so tired of reading comments from some about how we will suffer thru more rebuilding no matter who we might hire to replace RR. As has been indicated by me and so many other commentors, too many of you to have to mention but you all know who you are and I respect and enjoy your insights greatly, A new coach (especially if it was to be JH) are good enough coaches to be able to adapt to the talent they have on board and would be able to re-recruit alot of the guys on the team to make them feel embraced by the program. Again, just because RR was unable to do this when he came to AA, doesn't mean it will happen again, ok? See this is what amazes me, it seems as if these RR supporters have been numbed to that thinking somehow because it is what they noticed when RR came on board, as if that is how it would always be. Please realize that it doesn't have to be that way just because.

XTR

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:53 p.m.

"amzack I completely agree. Nobody seems to see that it took JH 4 years to put a 11-1 team on the field. It takes time to rebuild. if you look at UM they look to be great next year. Keep RR. Making a coaching change now doesnt make any sense" The performance of RR's team goes sideways. Close wins and big losses. The only difference between the 5-7 in 09 and the 7-5 now were the close wins to Illinois and Purdue. That is how close the difference. With the 5 losses, UM played better against MSU, Iowa and Ohio State in 2009 (Denard was not the starter) than in 2010. Next year, who do we beat with RR?

I love Michigan Football

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:45 p.m.

Rumor has it that Mike Martin is contiplating going pro. Do the RichRod lovers still feel good about this defense getting better next year?

XTR

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:45 p.m.

"...and in that 11-2 year, they beat #3 Oklahoma by 20 points and during the season #25,21,and 20 by a combined total of 78 points. Pretty impressive for a "not in the big boy conferences" system. Just saying." Those figs in WVU is irrelevant now. His record at Michigan is 6-18 Big Ten, 0-3 MSU and OSU in the same season for 3 seasons, record 3-9 and 5-7 seasons, NCAA violations, poor PR at public events. His WVU records not relevant anymore as his record at Michigan says he is a failure.

The Great Laker

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:36 p.m.

IMO Brandon has studied Martin's fumble and will only let RichRod go if he is confident that a viable successor has been secured. My money says he secures Harbaugh or keeps RR -------------------- My money says he secured Harbaugh sometime during or just after the regular season. Everyone involved has been WAY too quiet about this.

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:34 p.m.

jalittle 12 "Anyway, whether you like RR or not, given time, he will win more games. Period. Non debatable. All the major players are coming back for 2011 and he would win 8-10 games next year. BUT, he could win the Big Ten title..." He will win more games. Period. Non debatable? I would say that it is totally debatable, based on his RECORD and his performance in 3 years time. 15-21 and 6-18 BT is proof that RR will win? 6-18 in the BT is a MAJOR FAILURE (.250 percentage), considering every coach before him in the last 40+ years had at least a.775 winning percentage in the conference. Mike "If Brandon should fire RichRod, I expect a couple more years of turmoil. There is no guarantee that any new coach will fare better. Look at Notre Dame's recent experience with bringing in a new coaching savior every few years. Wow one guy practically guarantees more wins in the future under RR, and another practically guarantees a couple more years of turmoil and losses. Maybe DB better listen to them and hold on to RR. Mike " Give Denard Robinson a healthy and talented running back, the defense a better coordinator and another year of experience, RichRod a chance to recruit without the cloud of a potential firing or NCAA sanctions and the team a supportive fan base, we may all be pleasantly surprised with the results." Mike, RR is actually responsible for all of the things you mentioned above... He is responsible for not having a talented RB (why didn't he get one?); He is responsible for hiring the current DC and the one before, and he is also responsible for making them run HIS system - HE is responsible as the HC for the terrible D (and terrible special teams too); RR has already had 2 years of recruiting without "the cloud" of firing or NCAA violations (and HE is responsible for both of these clouds by the way); HE is responsible for not succeeding in his 3 years, and thus HE is responsible for losing the support of the fan base and the boosters & donors. You act like these things are the things that are causing RR to have a losing record, and it seems like more excuses coming from an RR supporter. HE caused all of these things to be the way they are... HE is responsible for them as HC, and for his losing record.

Eric

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 2:29 p.m.

So, you don't wait until after a Bowl game to evaluate your coach's season. you wait for two reasons. #1 his buy out is cut in half #2 Your replacement either wont announce or wont negotiate until his bowl game. IMO Brandon has studied Martin's fumble and will only let RichRod go if he is confident that a viable successor has been secured. My money says he secures Harbaugh or keeps RR

Hawaiian Neal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:57 p.m.

You know, I didn't read one "Jimmy is our guy" story last year in the blogs. What a difference one year makes, huh?

The Great Laker

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:54 p.m.

Agree with Edward. You work with what you have. Maybe we wouldn't have had to go 3-9 in 2008 had "piano on my back" Steven Threet not been forced to run the true spread on every down. Maybe Greg Mathews could have developed into the pro style receiver that Manningham and Arrington did. But no, Rich had to do it all at once. Harbaugh will make good use out of the players he is handed, regardless of the offense he runs.

I love Michigan Football

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:45 p.m.

I am so sick of the West Virginia to Michigan comparison.... Denard = Pat White then Dee Hart = Steve Slaton. It makes me sick to my stomach. This is the Big 10 not the Big East. We are NOT West Virginia... We really need to get back to our identity of powerhouse, smash you in your mouth football. Please come home Jimmy.

scott

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:39 p.m.

amzack I completely agree. Nobody seems to see that it took JH 4 years to put a 11-1 team on the field. It takes time to rebuild. if you look at UM they look to be great next year. Keep RR. Making a coaching change now doesnt make any sense.

scott

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:29 p.m.

I think those who think JH is the guy are missing the point. Yes he is a "Michigan Man" yes he is a great coach but he is a terrible fit for this michigan team. If he were to be the coach of this team next year who is going to be the QB? What about fullback? Who is going to be our blocking tight end? What about a good down field runner? Yes he can recruit but ask RR how depending on freshmen works. Right now we dont have the tools to give JH, a JH team. Good coach, terrible fit. JH represents 3-4 years of rebuilding, we dont need that. I know RR is the unpopular choice but he is the best option right now. 18 of 22 starters return they know the coach and the system. Give it one more year, things could be great. Maybe the new saying will be "Those who have patience will be champions".

amzack

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:27 p.m.

Mike: great post & agree 100%. Unfortunately, most on this site are impatient and unwilling to let RR's rebuild playout. They cherry pick stats and reference other programs with different situations to justify their position. DB wimped out - should have given RR support to allow successful recruiting and a 4th year to show continued improvement.

Hawaiian Neal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:14 p.m.

Finally, a reasonable assessment here! :) I am the same. I would support whoever UM decides is their coach and I would forgive Jimmy for dissing us the way he did. I wouldn't attack him personally or his family even if he has a couple of losing seasons while retooling again.

Sallyxyz

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:13 p.m.

Excerpt from: "Will the Gator Bowl be final stand for Michigan's RichRod?" Clarion Ledger dot com. Thanks to tulsatom for mentioning this article in this thread. "Think about this: This time next week, Rich Rodriguez will still owe West Virginia $1 million not to coach there; Michigan will owe Rodriguez $2.5 million not to coach there; and RichRod will be considering offers of millions to coach elsewhere." I'm not sure I agree that RR will have offers of millions to coach elsewhere after he's fired next week, but no doubt he'll end up somewhere, maybe a MAC team. I would think he's likely made plenty of contacts behind the scenes during December, if not sooner. Whether he gets an immediate offer in January, or ends up as an OC somewhere, or goes to the NFL, remains to be seen, and doesn't matter, as long as he's out of A2. No, Harbaugh's not the only answer, but I do think this has all been decided already (RR fired, JH hired). It's just a matter of waiting until the respective bowl games end.

David Vande Bunte

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:07 p.m.

I find myself torn between the two camps. If Michigan fires RichRod, I would fully support Jim Harbaugh as his replacement...I am just not convinced firing RichRod is the right thing to do. My main reason for wanting to support RichRod is that offensively, Michigan easily could compete for the National Championship. Half of our team is good enough to win. My major concern with firing Rich Rod is losing Denard Robinson. We have a truly special kid in DR, and I don't want a coaching change to interrupt his development into the most feared weapon in all of college football. I worry that any new offensive schemes brought in by a new coach would hamper that development, so I am leary. However, I am also leary of keeping RichRod, if he remains adamant about the defense. The defense was an abyssmal failure. The 3-3-5 has to go, period. if RichRod is unwilling to abandon the 3-3-5, meaning our defense will continue to be swiss cheese, I don't want him around. Basically, if RichRod can demonstrate a willingness to be flexible about the defensive scheme, and switch back to either a 3-4 or 4-3 based on the quality of the personnel available, keep him for what he brings to the offense. If he can't demonstrate that willingness to change the defense, get rid of him, even if it hurts the offense. I love the offense, hate the defense. Somewhere there has to be a middle ground. Something has to change. Either the defense has to change, or the coach has to change.

Hawaiian Neal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:02 p.m.

...and in that 11-2 year, they beat #3 Oklahoma by 20 points and during the season #25,21,and 20 by a combined total of 78 points. Pretty impressive for a "not in the big boy conferences" system. Just saying.

jalittle12

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 1:01 p.m.

I agree with PU MSU....It is Harbaugh or bust! No doubt. DB has to reunite the fan base and no other coach in America is going to it outside of Harbs. He has the enthusiasm, moxie, integrity, past history (UM), recruiting touch, etc....There are plenty of good coaches out there, but NONE of them would reunite Michigan and give us a shot at keeping our current players/recruits like Harbs would. AND, I personally believe it's a done deal. Why hasn't Harbs signed his Stanford deal? No doubt he will have NFL suitors, so it's just a gut call right now. Anyway, whether you like RR or not, given time, he will win more games. Period. Non debatable. All the major players are coming back for 2011 and he would win 8-10 games next year. BUT, he could win the Big Ten title and there would still be a LARGE percentage that wouldn't support him. In conclusion, it has to be Harbs, because if it is not, DB is going to have a storm brewing that he has never seen in the pizza biz. DB has already hung RR out to dry and then could bring him back?! How does that sit? Harbs gets everything accomplished. If not, ride out the RR train and hope he gets enough support to finish this years recruiting class in classic closing fashion.

Hawaiian Neal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:55 p.m.

You remember he had WVU as high as #2 in the nation (which included the "big boy" conferences), right?

Steve

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:47 p.m.

Win lose or draw, we need to be RID of RR, his philosophy will NEVER win in the Big Ten. Smaller but faster works great for smaller conferences but not the Big Ten!

Hawaiian Neal

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:46 p.m.

Lest we remember, before Jimmy knew there was a job opening, his uncalled for jabs at UM in the press. Didn't sound like a 'Michigan Man' then. Especially considering the phone numbers he knows in Ann Arbor. That was NOT the Michigan man thing to do.

PeteM

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:45 p.m.

I liked the column, and agree that assistants, small college coaches etc. can be successful in Division One. T there are counter-examples Dan Hawkins at Colorado for instance. What I didn't see in the column is anything addressing timing. A lot of Michigan fans (maybe not most, but a substantial minority at least) think that Rodriguez deserves one more year based on the (admittedly slow) progress in wins year to year, the emergence of Denard Robinson and the fact that hes had just 3 years. I would agree that if hes not competitive next year 9-3 or so with a victory against either MSU or OSU -- then he should go. In terms of making a change now the possible one-time availability of Harbaugh one of the top coaches in the country with Michigan ties -- changes the calculus for some people. If Harbaugh isn't available it's obvious that there are other coaches out there who might be successful at Michigan will be equally true next year. The question is -- won't that be equally true next year. Also, while Brandon said that hell decide after the bowl game, it also seems that, if he was going to hire a Brady Hoke or another team's coordinator, it would make more sense to have done it after OSU to allow that coach to meet his new team during bowl practices, save the recruiting class etc.

The Ben

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:42 p.m.

Mike: Thanks for the thoughtful post. As the "make a change" movement picks up steam, people are becoming more likely to ignore the extenuating circumstances that RichRod has faced. People like things to be simple, black-and-white, easy decisions. No one likes gray areas and exceptions to the rule. It's much easier to say "he hasn't won, get rid of him" than to look deeper and find reasons to believe that years 4-6 could be much more successful than years 1-3. Patience could very well be a virtue in college football, but I don't know if we will get our chance to find out.

Jim Nazium

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:41 p.m.

Possible scenario : Michigan, with a "Healthy Line-up" wins big, the Offense scores a Ton of Points, the Defense plays the game of their lives with actual backups rotating in and out of the game because the "Starters" are actually healthy and getting some rest. The Spread is ran to "Perfection" and the whole country is Impressed with our Team. Recruits can't drive here fast enough to sign on, anti- RR folk are screaming that the game was a "Fluke" and not to re-watch the awesome highlights because you might forget how much you are supposed to Hate this guy and that JH is our savior and how Desperate we are to have him come here and we should give him Anything he wants just to get him. Which still Doesn't Guarantee Anything, just more rebuilding and patience. I hope the scenario plays out and the Naysers are Wrong and our new era of Dominance begins and that RR Learns from his mistakes and makes the necessary changes to become a Legendary Coach. If we lose in embarrassing fashion, then he is pretty much Toast and my personal patience will have probably run out. But I would rather see them win and not have to re-build. Trust me, Any New Coach will have growing pains and if you wanted him so bad in the first place you would most likely lower your standards to give him time to turn the corner. It's like Politics, the President YOU VOTED for will get a Ton of Lee-way and the guy that beat your guy is the Devil and can do Nothing right. It's just Human Nature. Go Blue!!!

The Great Laker

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:31 p.m.

If you are going to pick a team to envy, at least pick one that challenges for national championships. Oregon, Auburn, Florida, Oklahoma, etc. You know... teams that run a modern offense. --------------------- You forgot Alabama, Ben, who runs a power, pro style O.....and last time I looked Wisconsin was #4 in the nation, which makes them a challenger seeing as how that's a higher ranking than two of those other teams you listed.

heartbreakM

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:29 p.m.

That article by Cleveland in the Mississippi press was interesting. THanks for the link. What I found interesting was that it referred to his time in Clemson as successful, as quoted by the MSU coaches. What the article does not say is that he was not head coach of that team. If RR was OC of a team, I don't think any of us would have a problem (unless he publicly made excuses every day). No one here is criticizing or praising Magee, for example. But RR is 'HEAD COACH' of a team, and he has been a failure by Michigan standards going back more than a century. Big difference.

Steve

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:29 p.m.

Mick/3 and out, Can't agree more. I truly believe that Hoke would make an excellent coach for Michigan. I still would like to see JH, but would be excited to have Hoke if we can't get him.

The Ben

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:27 p.m.

"Let's start getting back to power Michigan football NOW......so that I don't have to continue envying Wisconsin (whom I hate) every time I watch them. Now THAT'S midwestern power football!" If you are going to pick a team to envy, at least pick one that challenges for national championships. Oregon, Auburn, Florida, Oklahoma, etc. You know... teams that run a modern offense.

The Great Laker

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:23 p.m.

What did Robinson do against any decent team when the O wasn't down by 2 or 3 touchdowns? Michigan under RR is exactly what those teams in Houston, Hawaii, and Texas Tech were.......a team that trades scores and hopes they have the ball last. That is not football.....at least not to me. When it comes to REAL competition (not UMass or Delaware St.)the players recruited by RR are either not talented enough, not being coached properly, or both. Any way you slice it, it's been obvious from day one that this marriage was not meant to be. Let's start getting back to power Michigan football NOW......so that I don't have to continue envying Wisconsin (whom I hate) every time I watch them. Now THAT'S midwestern power football!

D21

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:17 p.m.

Interesting, the man in sunglasses on top left of the pix indicated how he suspects that AD Brandon felt about RR with his index finger and thumb. Oh, Happy New Year to you all! RR is gone after the bowl game, BANK ON IT!

Steve

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 12:17 p.m.

Liked the article, I agree that JH isn't the only option. While I believe he is the best option, I also believe that he will probably go to the NFL. Hoke would be a great call, but others would work too. I believe that RR should definitely go though, he is now and has from the beginning been a mistake.

Mike

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 11:53 a.m.

It is not my intention to be an apologist for RichRod. He has clearly made mistakes, but also in my opinion has not been given a fair chance by many in the press and fan base. He appeared to be at least the 3rd choice Martin pursued. He came in late in his first recruiting season at Michigan and inherited a team and recruits that not only did not match his spread system, but had some gaping holes in the talent pipeline. He managed to retain most of Carr's recruits, but not surprisingly failed to fill all the gaps. He drew the ire of West Virginia fans for his departure, but was not welcomed by many Michigan fans. This provided much fuel for those critical of RichRod from day one and an atmosphere where many continually looked to find fault. In my opinion, if he had not lost Mallett to Arkansas, his first couple years might have been much more competitive. This in turn would have aided recruiting in subsequent years and stemmed much of the fan criticism. In hindsight, RichRod should have done more to mollify and retain Mallett. However, like some previous Michigan coaches, he appears to have decided that it was more important to have players committed to his program than the most talented players that were not all in. Some in the media appear to have a vendetta against RichRod. The early Free Press stories that sparked the NCAA investigation were inaccurate and greatly exaggerated. The major violations found are of a nature that some have suggested most major football programs if put under the the microscope would be found in violation. The NCAA did not find RichRod guilty of failing to promote an atmosphere of compliance. It is interesting to contrast the reaction of the Michigan fan base to these violations to the reaction at Ohio State to the recent violations there. Michigan has suffered through a spate of injuries this year that have further depleted the thin defense. However, few appear willing to give RichRod the benefit of the doubt. If Brandon should fire RichRod, I expect a couple more years of turmoil. There is no guarantee that any new coach will fare better. Look at Notre Dame's recent experience with bringing in a new coaching savior every few years. It is not clear that Jim Harbaugh wants the Michigan job or that he would stay the course. There is reason to speculate that JH will be an NFL coach within a few years and Michigan might be just another stepping stone, even if he accepts the overture. There is a tendency for many to look at Brady Hoke and others through rose-colored glasses. The anyone but RichRod supporters may get their way, but may not like the result. Give Denard Robinson a healthy and talented running back, the defense a better coordinator and another year of experience, RichRod a chance to recruit without the cloud of a potential firing or NCAA sanctions and the team a supportive fan base, we may all be pleasantly surprised with the results.

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 11:35 a.m.

tulsatom... it is interesting to get people's perspective that are looking from the outside. When you get the perspective of the fans at OSU, MSU, Wiscy,... they obviously want RR to stay. But more and more are coming to the realization that a Michigan program that is this far down is hurting the BT, and it is also hurting them in the BCS standings. A win over UM these last 3 years is not worth nearly as much as it used to be in the BCS. edjasbord... one of the reasons I like this site, other than it obviously is about UM football, is that is does have "thinking beings". Well, mostly.

JimB

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 11:28 a.m.

Pederson from Boise State. Gives him the ability to showcase his skills at a real school and win national championships. Has a modern style of play to keep th program in the 21 century

edjasbord

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:59 a.m.

Tater - go back to Mgoblog where assumptions like "just as they are about to become champions" go unchecked. You will be confronted by actual thinking beings here. Many of us who want a change do so because we do not believe RR has the ability to lead this team, here in the Big Ten, to a championship. There is very little indicating that the kids playing for UM right now will have anything close to a chance at being a champion before they leave. Folks at MgoBlog laud assumptions like the defense will magically become an unstoppable force in one year after three years of neglect. You need to do a little more thinking around here.

edjasbord

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:49 a.m.

Pete - I've been critical of you in the past, but this was a nice, balanced read. Well done.

tulsatom

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:49 a.m.

An interesting perspective on RR by a Mississippi State (Jackson Miss) journalist who is on the outside looking in. http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=201012300345

obama from kenya

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:44 a.m.

The next coach needs to be someone that Bo had touched as a young man. A Michigan Man.

P U MSU

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:31 a.m.

mission, The statement I made is a generalization. It certain could not encompass everyone. How many gimicky offense comments have we seen? We got a pretty good kid out of Cali to kick for us next year. This should help our special teams. Only time will truely tell here. Gibbons ranked #6 in the country and we all know how well that has turned out. Certainly RR is not the only one who missed on this kid.

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:19 a.m.

PU MSU "The main reason DB is making a coaching change is because the fan base is divided. The traditionalists hate the spread offense and want to see "Big10 football." (Whatever that means.)" You definitely are not speaking for me either in this overly simplistic comment. So anyone who does not want RR anymore is a Big 10 traditionalist that hates the spread? What we want is a well coached, well balanced TEAM that features a good or great offense (the spread would be fine), a good or great defense, and solid special teams. And we want to be at the very least COMPETITIVE for the BT championship. Like it or not Tressel/OSU (and lately Wiscy and even MSU) has set the bar, and we are not even close to it. Once we can be competitive and then start winning BT championships again, that will lead to even better things. NONE of the above things have been happening, except that we have a decent offense rated # 22 in the country. Everything else has been missing these last 3 years. "Ironically the two best offenses in the country are in the national championship." Again PU MSU, this is too simplistic of a comment, and is not looking at the overall teams. Yes Oregons's O is rated # 1 (49.3 ppg), but their D is rated # 14 in the nation (18.4 ppg). Auburn's O is # 6 (42.7 ppg) and their D is # 54 (24.5 ppg). (UM O was # 23 and sadly our D was # 102). There are also some ratings for Special Teams: Returns (Punts & Kickoffs): Oregon is # 1 in this category, while Auburn is only # 78. (sadly UM was # 110). FG's: Oregon 12 of 16; Auburn 15 of 20; (and sadly again UM 4 of 13)

heartbreakM

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:16 a.m.

People The spread is not what we hate. Who cares what kind of offense you have. What you need is GOOD FUNDAMENTALS. That is what RR has not had since he was our coach. It does not matter what you run, as long as your blockers do their job, the footwork is good, the receivers catch, the players don't fumble, the defensive line sheds blocks, the players take good angles and tackle..... RR managed to come in and not have that type of team performance in 3 years. Bo writes about this in his last book w/Bacon (regarding the 1985 season and coming back after 6-6 season). Good fundamentals lead to improved performances throughout the season, which we have not had. Good fundamentals mean that you outperform the opponent on the field, as Iowa, Wisconsin, MSU, OSU PSU did. You don't fumble kickoffs. The reason that I want RR gone (and a lot of others too) is because he is a bad fit for Michigan, and has been since day one. He does not understand our legacy nor our conference. He does not embrace it. He does not behave like a leader. He makes excuses. His results are horrible. He underachieves. He did not use the talent that was here and has consistently disrespected the players and the old coaches. Need I go on? This article is right on that DB needs a succession plan, but if they don't get the guy they really think will elevate the program, I think firing RR just to fire him may not be the smartest thing as continuity is important also. (Another criticism of RR by the way--he broke all continuity w/the Michigan football successful program except for Fred Jackson).

P U MSU

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 10:03 a.m.

Ageed on the mootness. Have a Happy New Year all. Hopefully all of this comes to an end soon.

Jeff Richard

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:53 a.m.

Both Jim Harbaugh & Brady Hoyke struggled in their first years at Stanford and SDSU with nearly identical records to Rich Rod at UM. Patience rules the day! If Stanford and SDSU reacted as those proposing the firing of Rich, both schools would not be winners today and both would be rebuilding and reorganizing under a new coach. JH and BH were not "big splash" hires initially, no more than RR at UM. If we do keep RR, I believe we will be chuckling at the thought we were proposing to chuck him. If we release RR, I believe we will watch RR be successful elsewhere, while we spend the next two years restructuring. Either way - Go Blue!

InsideTheHall

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:40 a.m.

When looking at potential candidates under the radar the name Soup Campbell should be mentioned. He most likely will not get the job but we need to bring a Michigan Man back from Iowa and have him on the staff.

P U MSU

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:33 a.m.

Edward, Yes respectable is all that is needed. I do not think that Michigan is far off from being respectable. Look at what ILL did this year with a simple change in philosophy. 90th ranked defense to top 35 defense. Take the Michigan game away and they are a top 20 defense. All with a defensive coaching change.

tim

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:21 a.m.

This story shows us that with football and the rest of life is just as much about ( being at the right place at the right time) as it is about your skills.

P U MSU

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:21 a.m.

Edward, You analysis is spot on. But look at how far DR has come as a passer in a single year. If given the time to further improve, do you not think that his passing will be better? OUR spread is a necessity of the situation. We do lack a runningback. But this is the same coach who coach Steve Slaton. We simply do not have a Steve Slaton. It's not that OUR spread is set up any differently than Auburns or Oregons, its that we are working with different tools. So imagine with for a minute. DR makes improvements in throwing and Dee Hart gives us our Steve Slaton. I really believe they are a year from greatness. It's too bad that we will probably not see it.

Matt

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:20 a.m.

Pete, why did you conveniently ignore the fact that Gene Chizik's team was successful this year with a QB that should have been ruled ineligible and a defensive end (Nick Fairley) that may be the dirties player in college football? People on this site harp about RR's lack of integrity -- in response, I submit that his players are an extension of the methods he uses to develop players. If you see the way with which players like Denard and Tate carry themselves, how could ANYONE suggest that RR does not put his student-athletes first? You people have gone absolutely bonkers, to the point where you're convincing yourself that Brady Hoke -- a coach that had a losing record at BALL STATE! -- would be a viable candidate for this position. Is there any harm whatsoever in giving RR another year with a fully mature offense and a defense not wracked by losing six of its eleven starters to injury during the season??

stunhsif

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:10 a.m.

Please, oh please keep RR for another year. He is the greatest, he just needs another chance! Go Green Go White

P U MSU

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:07 a.m.

Nobowl, "Facet great coaches know something RR doesn't, you win with defense." Ironically the two best offenses in the country are in the national championship. "Hate them or not all you have to do is look in Columbus and see that." And how has that great defense done against the rest of the country? What is there bowl record against the SEC again? The problem here is fans like yourself that are unwilling to open your eyes and see the concept of college football changing.

tulsatom

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 9:04 a.m.

In my view Harbaugh would be the best fit for the job but I agree that Brandon should have a 'Plan B' and a 'Plan C' in case Harbaugh doesn't want the job. With the previous AD, it appeared that the philosophy was "We're Michigan and a great coach will just fall in our lap" and it just doesn't happen that way. If Carr and Harbaugh didn't have the dispute over academics among U-M football players before LC's last year, Harbaugh would already be U-M's coach and U-M wouldn't have had three nightmarish seasons with all the draconian changes in philosophy and types of players recruited. The exception to this is Denard Robinson, who is a special player who thrives under RR's offense but would also thrive under any system because he has phenomenal athleticism.

johnnya2

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:58 a.m.

" If we go after another coach there iis still recruiting issues, and no guarantees that the next coach will be any better" There are no guarantees, but I could give 99% odds that whoever they hire will not be worse. He will not put Michigan on probation. He will not have the WORST special teams play in the Big Ten if not country. He will not have the worst defense in the history of UM football THREE consecutive years. He will not cry or sing at the football bust. HE will surely not come with a lawsuit from DAY ONE. He will not think UM and OSU is "just another game". He will likely win at least ONE game against MSU, OSU, IOWA, and Penn State. No, there is a small chance he won't be better, but I would put my house up that he won't be worse.

Steve Pepple

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:53 a.m.

A comment that violated our conversation guidelines and several responses to it have been removed.

NoBowl4Blue

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:52 a.m.

Fact! More than half of the Michigan fans see Rich Rod aka crybaby as an unachieving disappointment who has done nothing but embarras the University. No way can DB keep him without risking more backlash. Fact U of M is still a great job and will attract a great coach not a last minute replacement like RR. Facet great coaches know something RR doesn't, you win with defense. Hate them or not all you have to do is look in Columbus and see that. Fact! Whoever the new coach is will be an improvement.

I love Michigan Football

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:36 a.m.

from an article I read earlier: But if you're wondering where that brash, no-apologies attitude comes from, it seems Harbaugh was just born with it. He was the kid who had to make every catch, grab every rebound, skate down every puck. And it wasn't his fault if you got in the way. "I wish I had a better handle on who I am, but I always had to win at everything," said Harbaugh, 47. "Looking back, it was uncontrollable." Michael Lombardi, who helped hire Harbaugh as a Raiders assistant in 2002, said his friend wants to beat you at everything. "Even if you were playing checkers. He doesn't like to lose, he can't change that and it's unbelievable how far he takes it." Harbaugh even refuses to lose to himself. As the University of San Diego coach, Harbaugh did push-ups during team stretching. He always had to do more than the previous day. "Eventually, he got up to about 100," said Josh Johnson, an Oakland Tech and USD product who now is the backup quarterback for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. "That made an impression. We'd count out the number and cheer for him just like it was during a game. He was building a competitive atmosphere throughout the team." Johnson added that some of the things Harbaugh did and said would "upset the people on the other sideline." But, Johnson continued, you loved him as your coach. It's no different at Stanford. "You would not want to play for anybody else," Cardinal defensive back Michael Thomas said. "He'll say, 'Those guys think they're going to come in here and bully us! But we're going to show them!' Our attitude starts with him. The way we play reflects him. His passion, energy, enthusiasm is contagious."

P U MSU

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:35 a.m.

Pete, I have to disagree with you here. I think that it is Harbaugh or bust. It seems very apparent that RR is gone. There is simply no reason to hang him in the wind like this if he is your guy. The man reason DB is making a coaching change is because the fan base is divided. The traditionalists hate the spread offense and want to see "Big10 football." (Whatever that means.) Others look at the landscape of college football and recognize that it is changing. These people believe that Michigan will be ahead of the game and that RR will do great things if he is given the chance. I do not want to make this a debate about RR, so I will get to my point. Whether you are a traditionalist or the other guy, we can all recognize that Jim Harbaugh is a great coach. While I believe his first year or two would be difficult, in the end he will get the job done. He is a Michigan Man. He played for Bo, and we all know how much Bo is loved around here. The other coaches you have mentioned are all very good coaches in my eyes, BUT they all have one major flaw - they are not Jim Harbaugh. We are in a situation much like the last coaching change. Everyone wanted Les. But, Bill Martin could not produce. Dave Brandon must get JIm Harbaugh. He must reunite this fan base. I do not believe that there is another coach in this country better suited to coach our current team than the one who is already there. With that said, a change is on the horizon. Will Dave Brandon be responsible for making Michigan, Michigan again? Or will he repeating the history laid out by Norte Dame? Only time will tell. Good luck to the boys in blue.

XTR

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 8:01 a.m.

"He made one point clear...his only "wish" going forward was: "That our program continues to WIN with INTEGRITY"" - Lloyd Carr No wonder there were lots of talk that Carr was doing some back jobs against RR. True or not, it was painful for LC as well to his assistants at what happened to the program. It was a double blackeye, from winning with integrity to losing with violations.

missionbrazil

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:55 a.m.

For all RR supporters that think JH's record is the same as RR's, read this article at espn: http://espn.go.com/blog/pac10/post/_/id/17404/worst-to-best-stanford-seniors-live-transformation Here are some excerpts: * In 2006, the Cardinal went 1-11. That was the most losses in school history and worst record since an 0-10 mark in 1960. It was the program's fifth consecutive losing season, and coach Walt Harris was fired after just two years. * In 2010, the Cardinal went 11-1. That set a school season record for victories. Stanford, ranked fourth in the final BCS standings, hasn't finished ranked in the top five of the AP poll since 1940. * "It's unbelievable," Sherman said. "I can't even express to you the emotions I have and the other seniors have. Coming in the way we did, obviously, 1-11 and now leaving with a record-setting season, one of the best offenses in the country, one of the best defenses in the country. Just a great team. We love each other. I can't explain it to you. It's a combination of joy, happiness, pride, a lot of things. Man, watching these guys grow up. We've all come a long way." * Sherman was a freshman on the 2006 team. It was shut out twice. It lost to San Jose State. It ranked 118th in the nation in scoring (10.6 points per game) and 108th in scoring defense (31.4 ppg), meaning it lost by an average of three touchdowns. * Enter Jim Harbaugh, who introduced himself by stating, "I vow I will attack this endeavor with enthusiasm unknown to mankind." * "It was just a whole different way of coaching.... Coach Harbaugh definitely brought a different energy and enthusiasm to the program. Basically, he brought a belief in winning that I don't think guys had before he got here," Sherman said. * The 2010 Cardinal not only won, they dominated. They outscored foes by an average of more than 22 points. They ranked No. 8 in the nation in scoring (40.3 ppg) and No. 11 in scoring defense (17.83). They recorded three shutouts for the first time since 1969. They set a school record for points (484), and quarterback Andrew Luck set a school record with 28 touchdown passes. For the second consecutive year, the program produced a Heisman Trophy finalist -- Luck -- who followed Gerhart, the 2009 runner-up. JH >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> RR

W2j2

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:52 a.m.

In hiring a head football coach, you need someone who has energy, proven ability to win and recruit, and someone who can communicate to people where you are going with the program, Bellotti said. That is exactly who we have in RichRod. He will be a great coach, given time.

tzgoblue

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:48 a.m.

Pete I wrote the exact same thing in one of my posts a few weeks ago. I said that it would be great to get JH, but if he isn't available or decides he doesn't want the job, there are several other options across the country that could revive our program. I continue to feel that RR just isn't the right fit for Michigan and there is nothing to be gained long term by continuing to give him more time. The on field results after 3 yrs speak for themselves, he has lost players that he recruited, he continues to make statements that make people wonder if he has control of what is going on or needs to be done to get this mess turned around. He continues to tell us he knows what needs to be done to fix things, but he never gives us any specifics. He indicated the team had improved during the bowl practices in the past few weeks, when asked in what specific area, he replied with "I can't put my finger on it, I'm not really sure". If DB doesn't make the move after the Gator Bowl, he is leaving himself and his legacy as the UM AD wide open for major criticism and possibly a short tenure in the position.

A2lover

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:46 a.m.

If he has ANY sense at all, Brandon will go for Harbaugh. If he's not the one, then Hoke is an excellent second choice. But my question is, has Brandon the sense to make a change. Up till now this whole coach change fiasco has been about him, holding everyone hostage by continuing this coitus interruptus of when, if, maybe, wait and see, game. I still say, put RR out of his misery, fire him (too late now of course, just before the ridiculous bowl game) and bring in a man of integrity, sportsmanship, vision and leadership, JH or BH. But then again, we all know the ignorance and arrogance of the U of M administration.

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:38 a.m.

Gosh we are so thankful that Dave Brandon's close friend and confidant Theo is here to straighten us all out with the real-scoop. Go Blue Theo.

The Great Laker

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:21 a.m.

Brady Hoke runs both the spread O and the 3-3-5 defense. We have seen enough of that junk at UM and will NOT be bringing in someone who will continue it. It's time to get back to true midwestern power football at Michigan, and if they don't get Harbaugh then it should be someone who employs a pro style O and a front four D. Undersized players who can't withstand contact are not the Michigan way.

Ignatz

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:19 a.m.

Let's wait until the NFL fills their open head coach jobs, especially the one in San Francisco. I don't think Mr. Harbaugh will be available once that dust is all settled. Mr. Hoke, on the other hand, might be another Jim Tressel-like figure, rising up through the ranks. He would seem to be a more desirable figure.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:17 a.m.

BlueGator, thx for the response. I like Peterson and Patterson also, even though that sounds like a law firm, Lol! I think that they're probably too comfortable at their respective schools to make a move. Like I said earlier, I can't wait for this to be over so that all us M fans can unite again! Okay, now I'm gonna try to get some shuteye, my insomnia seems to be waning, crossing my fingers.

3 And Out

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:17 a.m.

I watched Lloyd Carr's Retirement speech from 2007 earlier tonight. It is over on YouTube, if you want to check it out. He made one point clear...his only "wish" going forward was: "That our program continues to WIN with INTEGRITY" Well, it is obvious that the "big splash" hire of Mr. Martin, did not deliver in either of those respects. Mr. Martin, who curiously disappeared late in his career as AD, leaving the all-important football program hanging in the balance of his deficient attitude. Martin was "out sailing" and it hurt the program more than his financial fundraising could ever possibly match. So now we are in a position of a possible new hire. The point is...that a "big splash" is not at all what Michigan needs. What we simply need is a coach that will instill competitive, disciplined football on the players...and recruit high quality kids that are on the level of NFL type prospects. The rest will take care of itself. No more "mamby pamby" sloppy football and crying attitude. The time is now to be competitive and aggressive, while instilling integrity back in to the program. Winning with character and cruelty has been Harbaugh's philosophy at Stanford. Whether Michigan actually lands Harbs or not... that philosophy must come with the next coach. The current coaches do not have the ability to even fathom the meaning behind those 2 concepts, let along instill them in the program. Go Blue.

sameollions

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:16 a.m.

blah, blah blah.... Give us some names and do some analysis, instead of saying things everybody already knows!

Blu-n-Tpa

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:14 a.m.

Mick (NOT LII) Thanks for the morning laugh. Nothing like waking up to an oxymoron to start the day. "Perfect marriage" is a little tough to wrap my head around at 7am. Except for some of those who have their heads in the sand, everybody knows that DB is going to make a move. Although I think, feel, hope, light candles, wish on falling stars, (you get the picture), Coach Harbaugh is as good of a fit as Michigan could want, I understand there are others who could drag UM back from the abyss. DB understand that and he will do his job. Since Michigan football is the powerhouse for the University's Athletic Dept. he knows he will be judge well into the future on this hire. Let's hope he nails it and that a perfect marriage lasts a long, long time.

BlueGator

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:07 a.m.

Mick, If JH isn't the one, I sure could settle for Brady Hoke. He wouldn't be my preferred second choice, but I doubt Chris Petersen or Gary Patterson would be on DB's radar, nor that either would leave their teams at this point anyway.

Sean T.

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7:02 a.m.

Go Blue!!!

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 7 a.m.

Thank you Sean T, much obliged and I'm really glad you respect my comments as I thoroughly enjoy and respect your comments. Let's hope this nightmare will be over by the end of next week. And Go Blue always!!!

Sean T.

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:47 a.m.

Mick, You are worlds away from Mick52 and should be thoroughly recognized for your comments. I agree with your comments about Hoke whom I believe is a very good coach. I also believe that it shouldn't be Harbaugh or bust but if it isn't JH, DB must sift the country for a good fit for the University. Though I believe that there are many coaches that are better than RR, we still need the perfect match.

Mick

Thu, Dec 30, 2010 : 6:19 a.m.

Pete, good story and I agree with you on the notion of not just going for the big hire as an answer to everything. However, I really do believe that JH has a special skill set, not to mention the affiliation and history he has with U-M. I think it would be the perfect marriage (if there is such a thing, and I chuckle myself as I write that). Brady Hoke is a name that had been poo poo'd greatly on many M related blogs till people saw SDSU last week look like a well oiled machine. Living out here in San Diego, I've been able to see first hand the exceptional job in only two years that he's been doing. The guy is a class act, well liked, can recruit and he loves U-M. He would be my personal 2nd choice actually, and if JH didn't take the job, we'd be lucky to have Hoke. RR needs to go somewhere else, bottom line. Also, please fellow commentors, don't confuse me with Mick52, we have very different opinions. Someone on an earlier thread was responding to him and just called him Mick.....you gotta put the 52 behind that, again please. I cringed for a minute when I saw that.