Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 4:40 p.m.

Heartbreak--not in his makeup. PC: Easy. 1) The network that employs him broadcasts the SEC exclusively. Stick to that. 2) Do what any reasonable person would under that circumstance: decline to comment on the Michigan football program, esp. so soon after having been fired. he is not obligated to open his yap. Good Night and Good Luck

Patrick Caveney

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 3:44 p.m.

while separation from the university is best for all parties, it is also his job as a college football analyst. how can he avoid talking about one of the biggest football programs in the history of the sport? be easy if he was an ex-coach for a school from something like a DIV II or MAC school under same circumstances. such questions wouldn't be asked since most of them are irrelevant and not a mainstream top school like the winningest program in the history of the sport.

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 9:52 a.m.

Definition of Conflict of interest: "A conflict of interest occurs when an individual or organization is involved in multiple interests, one of which could possibly corrupt the motivation for an act in the other." See Wikipedia. As for your absurd statement: neither Davie, nor Holtz, nor Bowden critiqued the teams they left behind. Yes--years afterwards they spoke about teams to which they had no connection. When was the last time you heard Charlie Weiss talk about last year's or this year's ND football team? Didn't happen. What did George Perles say about the team he left to his successor and what that team ought to on the field? Didn't happen. Did Bo set up Mo? Did Mo, who got FIRED, set up Lloyd? Did Lloyd set up the WCiMFH? Nope. All of these guys understood that, whatever they said, would appear to be self-serving. They kept their mouths shut about the team they left behind. Enough English for you? Or do you need a dictionary? Good Night and Good Luck

truebluefan

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 4:15 a.m.

Conflict of interest? What on earth are you talking about? En ingles, por favor. "None of 'em"? Not a single one, eh? I hate to burst your little bubble, but Lou Holtz and Bob Davie have analyzed, predicted (yes, even the dreaded win totals...GASP!) and dissected Notre Dame football for many years. Classless rednecks.

rs63

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 12:19 a.m.

If I felt like I was building something, I would want to see it through too. RR left some talent, mostly on offense. He decimated the defense. His staff was poor recruiters, poor with fundamentals, poor on technique, abysmal on defense, and poor on preparing athletes to succeed at the next level. oh, did I mention he spat on tradition and nearly destroyed the atmosphore of "The Michigan Family" Hoke is a Michigan man with Michigan mentality and honors and reveres Michigan tradition. They will be tons better just by the improved fundamentals, techniques and work ethic. The key is bringing in Mattison to coach the defense and the ability to recruit once again. This team has the potential to be a lot better than most expect and it gets better from there. Watch and enjoy Michigan faithful, good things are happening and this is only the beginning. I lobby for an asterisk by the RR years. for those were not TRUE MICHIGAN teams.

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Thu, Aug 18, 2011 : 11:53 a.m.

BTW: Why ILL >>>>> OSU when UM played both last year and will play both this year? Weird skewing of your so-called "stats" to *prove* your point. Guess that means you can't prove your point without makin' it up. Now, go watch the SEC on CBS. Good Night and Good Luck

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Thu, Aug 18, 2011 : 11:12 a.m.

Gotta love it. The slappies have forever decreed that the loss to Appy State, defending FCS Nat'l Champion, was worse than the loss to Toledo the following year, one of the worst teams in the FBS. But now we find out that "UMASS > EMU" Whatever. As I said, the slappies never give up. Keep on a goin' TrufanoftheWCiMFH. You'l be able to get all you want of him on CBS this fall. Good Night and Good Luck

truebluefan

Thu, Aug 18, 2011 : 4:54 a.m.

Eh, whatever. The website probably doesn't like the symbols I'm using. Either way the point is the schedule this year is easier than last year. I don't think it's difficult to understand.

truebluefan

Thu, Aug 18, 2011 : 4:47 a.m.

Not sure what happened to my post. A bunch of verbiage was deleted. BGSU > Minn at home Illinois >>>>> OSU at home (obvious to most)

truebluefan

Thu, Aug 18, 2011 : 4:44 a.m.

Oh boy. Another doozy from Eddie. UConn > WMU @ND = ND at home UMASS > EMU (worst team in FBS, by far) BGSU Minnesota at home (did Minnesota win a game last season???) @MSU > MSU at home (score one more for Eddie) Iowa = @Iowa (Stanzi graduated, remember??) @ Purdue > Purdue at home replace @PSU with @ Northwestern (it's probably a tie) Illinois >>>> OSU at home (obvious to most sane people) You have three points. I have nine. Nobody in their right mind can say this year's schedule is tougher than last year's schedule.

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 10:04 a.m.

trufanoftheWCiMFH: *ND has a better team than last year *SDSU is better than any of the other three non-conf games last year. Bowl game winner. *Nebraska this year is, at worst, Wisky's equal last year. *OSU is OSU. Tough game no matter what one thinks. And if you think that the scandal hasn't united that team and given it motivation, you've never played the game of collegiate football--highly likely. *MSU and Iowa remain on the schedule. *Northwestern replaces Indiana as an away game. A much tougher foe than Indiana ever was. So, yes, a tougher schedule, I think. Don't like my opinion? There's a shock. Regarding your last comment: Hoke was not predicting. Hoke was setting the standard. Quite unlike your hero who came in blaming everyone else for his shortcomings and has never accepted any responsibility for the wreckage he created. The slappies never give up, do they? Good Night and Good Luck

bigblue

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 4:51 a.m.

wasn't Moeller fired?

truebluefan

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 4:05 a.m.

You aren't suggesting that this year's schedule is tougher than last year's...are you? May I ask what planet you reside on and in which universe? You talk about me not making sense? Sure, we play Nebraska but we do not have to play B1G champ Wisconsin. We don't have to play PSU this year either. Ohio State will start a true freshman QB, they have a new coach, they are reeling from scandal and we have them at home. The ONLY teams that will be tougher to beat this year are Notre Dame and maybe MSU (because we play there). That's it! Michigan returns 19 starters minus Stonum. If the "WCiMFH" won 7 games then the "BCiMFH" should be able to easily achieve that mark with an easier schedule. Again, why don't you believe Hoke when he says there are no excuses for not competing for the B1G title every year? Did he rule out 2011 when he made that statement?

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 12:58 a.m.

Thanks Mick and rs63. tbf: your post makes about as much sense as those the other night about Kellen Jones. Which is to say: none at all. So let me simplify it for you: The WCiMFH claims the team he left Hoke ought win 9 or 10 games this year. That same team last year (19 returning starters) was lucky to win 7 and was nowhere near winning 8 or more. Moreover, from where I sit, this year's schedule is tougher (albeit three home games against high quality opponents). So, were Hoke and company to win 9 or 10 games, it would seal the judgement on the WCiMFH as the WCiMFH. Seems fairly straight forward. That is, unless one is a slappy. Good Night and Good Luck

truebluefan

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 12:06 a.m.

"Setting unrealistic expectations for Brady Hoke on the way out." Unrealistic expectations? "This is Michigan" and we should be competing for B1G championships every season. Teams that compete for B1G championships typically win at least 9 games, don't you think? You don't believe Brady Hoke?

rs63

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 11:47 p.m.

Edward (love the s/n btw), the 2 posts of yours i've read are spot on. I'm not certain here, but I believe RR is the only UM coach to actually be fired, at least one who was still under a substantial contract. He can thank the UM for his cbs gig now too, would he be analyzing ANYTHING were he not the former UM coach? I, for one am thrilled to get back to MICHIGAN football, tradition, MEN "...THE TEAM, THE TEAM, THE TEAM"

Mick

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 10:22 p.m.

Ghost, your posts are brilliant and legendary IMO. However, I knew halfway through the 2008 season that it wasn't going to work. I have a U-M Football Radar Instinct like no other, people who know me will attest to that. The good news? My instincts are on fire for this staff, everyone will see soon enough! Go Blue for TiM!!!

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 8:07 p.m.

ROFL, Don. Contrary to what the slappies might think, I supported him up to the probation. After that, he lost me entirely. And that notwithstanding, the manner in which all three of his teams finished their seasons ought be proof to any reasonable individual that he was in way over his head. Good Night and Good Luck

DonAZ

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 7:58 p.m.

Were your knuckles white when you typed that? :-) Pretty much agree with everything you wrote, though ... my patience with that coach's tenure expired before the end of the season last year. I'm a hopeful man when it comes to Michigan football, but there was NOTHING I saw that led me to believe my hope was wisely invested in that coach. Nothing.

rs63

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 1:27 a.m.

James, you are buying the snake oil, I don't "hate" RR, objectively he grades a D to a D+ and only cuz the 8th ranked offense his final year, outside that he would get an easy F. Scott, Hoke would have solidified this program from day one. The recruiting would have been light years better and the kids would have been taught tradition, technique and fundamentals the last 3 years. The program would not have taken a 3 year haiatus and the reputation would not have been tarnished. He fits the Michigan mold, RR never did and never would have.

rs63

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 11:28 p.m.

Here's the issue(s): 1) Meeeeeechigan football IS TRADITION - when you bring in an outsider with the idea that he is going to change the program with the so called times, you are throwing out all that went before. RR was brought in with the idea of "keeping up with the rest of the conference offensively and putting in a spread offence". WHEN?, in 132 years has MICHIGAN EVER HAD TO EMULATE NORTHWESTERN, INDIANA, PURDUE, ETC? RR did ok with a spread offense. His arrogance and lack of respect for the program, history, tradition AND ITS ATHLETES is his downfall. RR was here for one reason only, to benefit RR. There is no other coach here who has been so blatantly self-serving. The 2 best things he did for UM were these: he was able to bring in Denard, and he suggested / recommended Coach Belein for th BB program. 2) mostly he and his staff were terrible recruiters. UM has a long history of O line prominence. He struggled to attract O linemen, in fact some of the better ones jumped ship when he came in. 3) because he ran a non-prostyle offense, pro type and pro caliber athletes went elsewhere for 3-4 years. 4) because the "change" mantra was on the offense, he could hardly bring in the numbers of quality defensive prospects that other schools could. 5) athletes that saw his program as a college type program, no one that wanted an athletic career after college was too keen on embracing it. 6) This has been "the Michigan Family" for as long as i've been around and more. Under RR, The program was treated with mercenary attitudes. RR was a fairly intelligent offensive coach. He was a lousy defensive coach, a lousy recruiter, a lousy head coach and he trampled on 132 years of tradition, excellence and loyalty. Part of the blame can go to the administration, because they didn't do thier due dilligence on RR, and they sort of gave him the direction of changing the offense to what 9 of 10 Big 10 schools were running at the time. UM is suposed to set the bar

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 7:33 p.m.

Scott wrote: "Hoke would be out right now if had been hired in 2008" Yes, he would, had he had the same record as the WCiMFH: *6-18 in the Big Ten *0-12 against Big Ten teams with winning records *1-13 against MSU/OSU/PSU/Iowa/Wisky *Never finished higher than tied for 7th in the Big Ten *2-11 against teams that were in the Top 25 at the time the game was played *Winless against teams that finished the season in the Top 25. *Three straight seasons not in the Top 25 (had not happened since 1965, '66, and '67) *From 24th in the nation in defense in 2007 (Carr's last year), to 67th in 2008, to 84th in 2009, to 110/120 teams in 2010 *A mediocre offense against quality teams (e.g., EMU scored more points against OSU in 2010 than we did). *Worst bowl loss in Michigan history *1st NCAA probation in Michigan history Yes--had Hoke had this record, he'd have been gone. Hence Brandon fired the WCiMFH. Your point? Good Night and Good Luck

DonAZ

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 6:13 p.m.

There is perhaps no more intellectually lazy rejoinder than "hater." I don't "hate" RR. I did not care for his coaching tenure, I did not have regard for his management style ... but that is a far different thing than "hating" RR. There are few things in this world I truly "hate." Mushrooms being one ... and I have to think hard about others. @Scott -- "... and need to realize that Hoke would be out right now if had been hired in 2008" ... really? Based on what do you make that claim?

azwolverine

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 6:11 p.m.

I agree that LC has certainly earned some mulligans. a 120-40 record, dominating MSU, PSU, Wisconsin, and a 6-7 record against OSU, not to mention a NC should earn any coach a mulligan. As for it being strange that he is suddenly around the program more...make of that what you will. Some might argue that it was difficult to be around the previous coach when that coach blamed 'the previous three or four February's' for his team being bad (in other words, it was LC's recruting, in RR's opinion, that made his team weak). I wouldn't want to hang around given that opinion, either. Hoke and Carr are pals and mutually respect each other. It makes sense that he would hang around again. In either case, I don't really care. The man in charge now is neither LC nor RR, it's Hoke. I care about Hoke's ability to bring this team back up to the level we are accustomed to and like the fact that he seems bent on doing it with no blame and no excuses. He's accountable, win or lose...and I think the team will rally behind him because of it.

scott

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 5:57 p.m.

Some people are way too bitter and need to realize that Hoke would be out right now if had been hired in 2008, but I'd say easy on the Carr stuff, he's been sketchy lately, but he was a great coach for a while and has earned a few mulligans in my opinion.

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 5:51 p.m.

trufanoftheWCiMFH: There is a very large difference between the current coach setting high standards for his team and telling everyone that he'll accept no excuses for failure, and the immediate past failure of a coach setting standards for the team he no longer coaches that he never reached and had no hope of ever attaining. Anyone but die-hard supporters of the WCiMFH would understand the difference. Good Night and Good Luck

rs63

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 1:06 a.m.

I see the parallel, in this regard. They are both outsiders with no real connection to nor love for the institution. They are both self-serving first of all and they are both quite arrogant. They are both willing to stybbornly insist on thier philosophy while it fails around them am are willing to drag the institution down around them in a vain and futile attempt at self agrandizement. They could reach epic lows for 10 years in hopes of one good result just to say I told you so while sticking thier chest out and dismissing the achievements of the rest of the team....other than that, they are completely different...hehehe

truebluefan

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 12:17 a.m.

ERMG -- Hoke (the man in charge of the UM football program) is setting expectations high with all the talk about "This is Michigan", no excuses, and competing for a B1G Championship every season. There is no gray area. Michigan is either in the running for the B1G title or the coaches have failed the kids and program.

Mick

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 10:11 p.m.

Pretty good post by you Wally, but I think "The Ghost" hits the nail on the head as usual!

Edward R Murrow's Ghost

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 7:35 p.m.

Nope. Isn't you. Two classless individuals. As for "Hoke says if the team doesn't win the B1G title this year, it's on the coaches. With a 9 or 10 win prediction, maybe RR knows something." I would not read it that way. Hoke is saying that I'm not going to blame the players or the previous staff for any failures this team might have (quite unlike his predecessor). He is saying that the buck stops with him. Good Night and Good Luck

truebluefan

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 4:24 a.m.

Mick -- all due respect but Rich Rodriguez has been at least a fairly successful FBS head football coach for many years. None of us here are FBS head coaches. What do we really know about his "yelling" and if it was detrimental to team performance? Come on.

rs63

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 12:58 a.m.

Basically agree....this staff does things the right way and will benefit from it. Remember, about our best o linemen (blank on name H... something I think) defected to O$U because of the yelling, swearing and loss of "Family Atmosphere" that has always been a Michigan trait. That said, football coaches do yell, they have been known to swear from time to time and are quite intence. The difference between most coaches and RR is the fact that most care about the team, institution and athletes, thus they may yell etc, but respect them. RR seemed to be more of a degrading type of yelling etc, not respectful to them...Brady has assembled a very good staff. RR never seemed to get his staff together let alone get the program organized. This team has the potential and the talent to win the conference and more. They would have been nowhere near that under RR, rest assured.

Mick

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 10:09 p.m.

Nice try Scott, that's not what I mean, of course coaches have to raise their voices from time to time. But the WCIMFH was a constant screamer obviously, I'm sure Hoke and Staff have raised their voices sometimes, but you don't have to yell all the time man! Like John B so aptly mentioned, his behavior on the sidelines was embarrassing. People just tune you out after a while, that's not teaching, that's just plain berating. When you see Hoke on Game Day you will see a calm and collected guy who's got his players attention.

John B.

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 8:10 p.m.

It wasn't just his 'yelling.' The way RR acted toward players on game days was immature and embarrassing. Disgusting and low-class, actually....

DonAZ

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 6:57 p.m.

Yeah ... I'm not going to invest too much in the "yelling" thing ... each coach has their style. Some coaches like to get in the faces and yell, others like to give the evil stink-eye to bad play. The key is how the players respond.

scott

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 5:55 p.m.

A football coach yelling during practice! Well I never...... I heard that one time he skipped tea time too! WHAT A JERK!

truebluefan

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 12:01 a.m.

So you would've rather he said 5 or 6 wins instead of 9 or 10? I can only imagine the backlash if that happened. Oh right, he should've said nothing. OK, well, he IS an analyst now and he is getting paid to make predictions! Some people just need to relax. If he had sour grapes he would've said 5 or 6 wins. Rich is a classy guy and wants to see Michigan football do well.

Ike

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 8:43 p.m.

I feel like he really can't say he was almost there because we have new schemes both offensively and defensively, new play calling, some new talent, and even a new attitude. His job is an analyst now, so he's payed to predict the number of wins a team gets, and 9 or 10 seems pretty reasonable for this Michigan team (hopefully!)

1st Down

Wed, Aug 17, 2011 : 1:48 a.m.

I wont.

Mick

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 10:27 p.m.

Scott, you've got to be an TSIO, MSU or PSU fan or something. Then I could understand you missing him.

D21

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 9:15 p.m.

Just little brothers (msu) and little sisters (buckeyes) spouting off nonsense (including clicking the "like" button like there is no tomorrow. It would be best for RR to wish the team well and leave it at that like Carr did. I have yet to hear Tressel doing the win-loss prediction for the buckeyes, either.

Terry Star21

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 7:41 p.m.

Oh, I get it - you're joking, sorry I't took me a second !

garrisondyer

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 4:59 p.m.

I won't miss him being the coach at all. I don't wish him any ill will; it's more that I'm just ready to move on.

BigWolverine13

Tue, Aug 16, 2011 : 3:43 p.m.

Will you miss having the wost defenses in the 100+ year history of Michigan?