Residents react to Ypsilanti Township ordinance banning street basketball
A makeshift court in a cul-de-sac in the Greene Farms subdivision sits without a hoop, which has been moved up the driveway.
Tom Perkins | For AnnArbor.com
Since Ypsilanti’s Township enacted its new basketball hoop ordinance on July 6 prohibiting basketball in the street and public-right-of-way, ordinance officials have received at least 14 complaints about violations.
Of those complaints, four have led to the township confiscating hoops.
Needless to say, some township residents are upset about what they say is the township barring a wholesome activity kids have enjoyed for generations.
“If you drive through Greene Farms you won’t see as many kids outside playing (since the ordinance was enacted),” said Greene Farms subdivision resident Helen Bryant, who has six kids from 10- to 25-years-old and received a warning to move her hoop. “My kids don’t go outside as much anymore.
"Basketball rims or games aren’t interfering with anything. If you want kids to get exercise and be productive, let them play outside like kids.”
But township officials say the ordinance is a result of years of complaints from neighborhood watch groups and residents about kids playing basketball in the street or right-of-way and not moving for traffic or pedestrians.
The state and county have laws that say items like hoops can’t be in the right-of-way, but neither has the manpower to enforce them.
Per the ordinance, residents playing basketball in public streets, cul-de-sacs, with hoops on lawn extensions or otherwise in the right-of-way will have an adheisve sticker placed on the hoop and their front door that warns that the hoop needs to be pulled out of the right-of-way.
If the hoop still is found to be in the public right-of-way after 24 hours, then it could be confiscated and the owner written a municipal civil infraction punishable by a $100 fine. The owner can then retrieve the hoops from the township.
Township officials have stressed that the ordinance is complaint driven and Mike Radzik, director of the office of community standards, previously said “we aren’t driving around looking for hoops to take.”
Greene Farms resident John Hoops is a neighborhood association leader who has lodged complaints with the township about hoops in the public right-of-way. He said he has seen groups of kids playing street basketball or basketball on a sidewalk not move for traffic or pedestrians.
“It dirties up the neighborhood,” Hoops said. “Some lady walking down the sidewalk shouldn’t have to feel afraid because a bunch of kids aren’t moving. People have driveways. Park the car in the street, which is a legal thing to do, and play basketball in the driveway.”
Radzik said the township has received complaints in West Willow, Ford Lake Heights, Tremont and Greene Farms since the ordinance went into effect. He said placing hoops in the right-of-way has always been illegal at the state and county level and the ordinance just gives local officials here a way to enforce it.
Helen Bryant's family moved their hoop from the left side of the sidewalk, which is in the right-of-way, to the right side, but slightly further up the driveway.
Tom Perkins | For AnnArbor.com
Radzik also previously said the hoops are a safety issue.
Hoops agreed.
“If they’re standing there in the road again and again they’re going to become a hood ornament. We don’t need to have kids getting hit to play street ball,” he said.
In the case of the Greene Farms and Ford Lake Heights subdivisions, the public right-of-way extends from sidewalk to sidewalk, which means the tract of lawn between the road and sidewalk is the public right-of-way and is included in the ordinance.
In Greene Farms, driveways are flat near the street and where the sidewalks run, while the rest of the driveway is on enough of an upward slant that it makes playing basketball difficult.
Most residents there placed their hoops in the tract of lawn between the road and sidewalk and faced the hoop in toward their driveway. So most of the games took place not in the street, but still in the public right-of-way.
The ordinance has forced hoop owners to place the hoops further up the slanted driveway.
But Hoops stressed that the flat part of the driveways is in the county’s right-of-way and residents can’t have hoops there because it is encroachment.
“The bigger issue is the ordinance helps uphold state law and county law," he said.
In Ford Lake Heights, there were no violation notices posted on the hoops until mid-August. Ford Lake resident Paul Nucci said most residents aren’t aware of the ban or that there was a vote by the Township Board of Trustees, who unanimously approved the ordinance.
But he added that those who do know of it are “against it, but not vocal.”
“There are no issues with the games in the street in this sub,” he said. “If you cruise this sub you will see hoop board in the street right now. The (neighbors) that I have talked to think it's sad one or two neighborhoods have issues and it impacts the entire region."
But a week later, Ford Lake resident Amber Nazimek came home and discovered a notice posted to her hoop, which was out in the street. She said her husband moved the rim back to the tract of grass between the sidewalk and street and left it facing the road.
The sticker posted to the hoop had very little information, Nazimek said, and it took an explanation of the ordinance from an AnnArbor.com reporter for her to understand that the hoop was still illegally positioned and could be confiscated.
She said her husband and his friends play basketball in the street because there is more room, but said it is probably safer for her 6- and 8-year-old kids to play in the driveway. Still, she didn’t like the idea of having to move her cars.
“It’s sort of a bummer to have to park the car in the street. That’s the reason we have a driveway, and it should be our choice,” she said.
Ford Lake resident Jeff Kompanis said he doesn’t have kids but he finds the ordinance “a bit heavy-handed” if kids are letting traffic through.
“On our street this wasn't really a problem as kids play in the street areas and pause for traffic to get through,” Kompanis said. “I've heard that there are areas where the kids do not let traffic through, and that's a problem, but it's a people problem, not something that needed legislation. I think a couple of cops stopping and letting the kids know 'the rules and customs' might have been fine. The ban seems like overreach.”
And he noted that the ordinance doesn’t apply to other activities.
“Kids on our street play street hockey, so the ban really doesn't affect them and they'd still be able to block traffic,” Kompanis said
In West Willow, New West Willow Neighborhood Association President Deborah Hawkins said that neighborhood’s residents were made aware of the ordinance at their neighborhood watch meeting.
“The vast majority of the residents there were in favor of there being a way to control and deal with this issue,” she said. “I think the idea of a warning is good as some may not know the ordinance or realize the danger that having the hoops in the street can pose for both players and drivers.”
Bryant noted that in Greene Farms, there is nothing for teenage kids to do. She said the nearby park only has equipment for younger kids, and there is nothing in the area that kids can bike to.
“After 10 years of my basketball hoop being in the exact same spot, I finally moved it just because it’s not worth the fight,” she said. “I can take my kids to the Y, Washtenaw Rec Center, but there are a lot of kids who can't go do that.
“Now what? Kids will start smoking pot. You should let kids play outside.”
And Bryant added a final thought.
“Why don’t you guys put rims out at the park so the kids can play basketball there?” she asked.
Tom Perkins is a freelance reporter.
Comments
HealthyHabits
Thu, Sep 5, 2013 : 10:35 p.m.
I live in a sister neighborhood to those in the discussion and have to say I was not aware of an ordinance. I came home today to find our basketball hoop gone--and did not receive any notice or warning. I read through some of the comments below and want to clarify for those who think parents are letting kids play in the street. Our driveway is quite sloped and the flattest part is at the base of the driveway. We live in a cul-de-sac. NO ONE WALKS OR COMES DOWN HERE except the 6 families who live here. I have lived here 17 years and have not had anyone plow the snow in my cul-de-sac for up to one week after a snow storm. The children who use our hoop are under 10 and don't really look like a posse of thugs waiting to take out walkers. The saddest part is that this hoop was for my 8 year old who has Type 1 diabetes-- the activity from playing basketball is an activity that is safe and fun. Imagine having to get 6 shots a day at the age of 8---- and shooting a few hoops with your friends helps you feel like a normal kid at least for awhile. And oh---I'd advise about not putting them on bikes and heading them to the parks--- I'd rather not see my child's face on an amber alert---there have been adults approaching children in our neighborhoods-- it's really not as safe out there as we all would like to pretend it is. I'd rather the township focus on the car that is sitting in my court now for 2 years on blocks and the squatters in the foreclosed homes in my subdivision. THAT would be a good use of their time.
Lauren Reed
Wed, Sep 4, 2013 : 8:08 p.m.
I live in the house next to Mrs. Bryant. She's a hard working woman. I tutored two of her kids this summer in algebra and reading, they're awesome young people. Very respectful and very very smart. The children in that house do not play ball in the street, nor do the children who have a hoop across the street on the corner house. They play in the driveway and on the sidewalk between the two houses, occasionally a ball may roll into the street. All of the comments talking about after school sports and summer activities- FYI, she's got them in soccer, baseball, basketball, they also attended summer camp and tutoring twice a week to keep their minds sharp. Her older son who just started high school worked part-time this summer. Two of the six children are adults and do not live at the house. During the summer it is NORMAL to hear kids of all ages playing outdoors. We live in a sub that had young children, those children are now between the ages of 8-18. They play outside as normal children should. Banning hoops will not stop the kids from playing in the front in the street, it will not stop them from playing street hockey (which will probably be the next thing since hoops are banned), or tossing a football in the street, or riding bikes in the street, or skateboarding, or rollerblading in the street, or making noise outside. There have been noise complaints too around these parts and people are so quick to blame it on the kids playing basketball. That's what happens when kids get older and play outside, they make noise. This subdivision should be family-friendly, hence the community backyards, but those are also partitioned off by fences. And as the article stated, the park is for small children and with the amount of registered sex offenders in this area, I would not want my kids traveling to the park alone. To those saying "so put your kid in summer programs," not everybody can afford to do that. A hoop or a hockey net may be it.
Julius
Wed, Sep 4, 2013 : 5:19 p.m.
Growing up, we never had problems in the road. I grew up in a neighborhood that really didn't have a lot of traffic, which made it conducive to this. The only people who came down our street were people who lived nearby. We were respectful, alert, and careful to move out of the way. There are worse things kids could be doing: Purse-snatching, vandalizing golf courses, shoplifting. . . . .
Mike
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 10:48 p.m.
As a former long time resident of West Willow, From 1959 to 1997, I believe that some of these young people have a good gripe about this ordinance. Kids play street hockey, they play baseball, catch, kickball, and various other childhood games. This ordinance attacks the one sport that African Americans enjoy. The parents of young people may not trust their children to go to a neighborhood park where other activities flourish. Raising children today is not like 50 years ago. The neighborhood helped the neighbors, today it seems that even good parents stay indoors because they are afraid of what goes on in the streets. It is ok to let your children play within a couple houses from yours, but keep them in sight. It is also true that todays children show little respect for any adult and even less for a driver of a car. If the township can improve safety at the neighborhood parks maybe they would be used. The parks were used years ago.
Nicholas Urfe
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 8:44 p.m.
A number of people are annoyed by the sound of a basketball. It is the sound of the ball, and also the sound of the kids having fun. This law gives them the ability to complain, even if the spirit of the law has not been broken.
Nicholas Urfe
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 8:41 p.m.
Kickball does not require a hoop. Just sayin'
jdmb03
Wed, Sep 4, 2013 : 12:44 a.m.
Neither does kick the can.
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 8:23 p.m.
I think what bothers me most is where we are going as a society. A generation ago this would not have been an issue and now it is? Just another thing we complain about that we used to take in stride. What don't we complain about anymore?
rutrow
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 5:57 p.m.
Might start smoking pot!!! Oooooooh! How horrible! Whatever it is that kids do (okay I'll avoid playing the 'race card' here, but.....) is always cracked down on. Always prohibited. Every generation since civilization began. And of course there is no alternative place to play. Nobody wants to pay their $24 a year in taxes for that to ever be provided. And so the kids who do in fact exercise consideration and courtesy for others get punished by far the most. As always.
DJ Earl
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:27 p.m.
We played Wiffle ball in the street. We have bases marked with masking tape. We yelled "CAR!" and moved out of the way when a car came along. The neighbors never complained. We grew up just fine. What's wrong with people today?
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 5:30 p.m.
social media - people are bored and complain about things for the sake of complaining also called trolling
UncleMao
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:15 p.m.
I honestly wish kids played basketball on the street in my neighborhood because it would cause traffic to slow down.
donderop
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:13 p.m.
I wish somebody would haul the space-hogging hoop monstrosity out of our driveway. Those things are ugly.
jdmb03
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:33 p.m.
Ask John Hoops if he wants to buy it. Ha! (Just kidding John)
DJ Earl
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:27 p.m.
Craig's list!
jdmb03
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:03 p.m.
"If you drive through Greene Farms you won't see as many kids outside playing (since the ordinance was enacted)," said Greene Farms subdivision resident Helen Bryant, who has six kids from 10- to 25-years-old and received a warning to move her hoop. "My kids don't go outside as much anymore. Mrs. Bryant also owns 5-6 vehicles that take up driveway space, you can't have that many vehicles and a hoop in the driveway, maybe it's time to make a choice.
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 3:51 p.m.
To all of those crotchety folk who proudly proclaim "the street is no place for kids to play" I have to ask - have you never played in the street? No touch football? No hockey (Wayne's World - CAR), no tennis? No hopscotch? Seriously folks - either you never had fun in your childhood or you just don't want kids to enjoy life ... yet another memory this generation will never have that older generations had. And spare me the safety concerns -unless you can show data don't spout off
Megan Turf
Wed, Sep 4, 2013 : 1:38 p.m.
No, i didn't play in the street. I played in the front yard, back yard, school yard and parks. We had a basketball hoop attached to the garage. I was taught, quite rightly, that streets were for cars and to stay out of them.
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 8:21 p.m.
Really? Parents told kids to play in traffic? Wow - you get the post of the day Yes we played on lawns and backyards and in parks AND we played in the street. Obviously not while there was traffic. I feel kinda dirty for even having to point that out to you
djacks24
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 5:39 p.m.
I played most sports in the yard on grass, at friends houses (also, in grass), or at school. Basketball outside of school was played in the driveway or at a court in the park. Never in the street. My parents cared enough about me to not tell me to go play in traffic.
UncleMao
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:21 p.m.
Many motorists are very entitled. They don't want to stop at cross walks or drive slowly in neighborhoods. On WDIV this morning a resident was complaining about reduced speed limits in school zones now that the students are back.
Peter
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 3:19 p.m.
There's a reason we're a perennial contender for fattest state in the union.
jdmb03
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 4:06 p.m.
I bike the trails around GF, there is also a park for the kids to play. We also have Ypsi parks that cost $10 per year.
Captain Obvious
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 2:31 p.m.
I'm surprised more people don't clean the junk out of their garages and use them for parking cars inside, as they were designed. Then a basketball hoop on your own property would not be an issue. I myself don't want to see basketball hoop's in parks, especially small neighborhood parks. The noise complaints would go up and then loitering would become an issue, only taxing the Sheriff's dept more with calls. The street is no place to play basketball, hockey, or any other sport. We teach our kids from the moment they can walk that the street is dangerous and to look both ways before crossing, yet at a certain age we allow them to play in the street? I'm glad the local municipality is taking the lead in enforcing State and County laws. Without the help of Mr. Radzik and the ordinance dept, who knows what this area would look like.
Use Logic
Wed, Sep 4, 2013 : 11:57 a.m.
I am in agreement with the ordinance, but the comment about "junk" in peoples' garages is invalid. Greene Farms has strict ordinances regarding "outbuildings" (ie sheds, etc). IF you have a lawnmower, snowblower, wheelbarrow, a few bikes, etc. there is simply no room for two cars.
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 3:53 p.m.
alas, these are no pre-schoolers playing hoops - they are teens and older so your point is moot unless captain obvious is being too clever for people to know he is being sarcastic
drewblowsalot
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 2:38 p.m.
So no playing in the streets or the parks....I guess driveways will have to do according to Captain "Get off my lawn" Obvious.
djacks24
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 2:28 p.m.
Those driveways look fine for basketball. Don't really see why they would need something in the street. Back when I was a kid the only option was a hoop and backboard mounted on the garage. If the garage wasn't regulation height or you had a gravel driveway, too bad. Other option was to go find a park. Maybe if these homeowners had created a checklist of priorities (like suitable driveway for basketball or access to a nearby park with a basketball court) they wanted in their home purchase before buying a house, then this wouldn't be such an issue.
djacks24
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 2:20 p.m.
""It's sort of a bummer to have to park the car in the street. That's the reason we have a driveway, and it should be our choice," she said." And the reason there is a street in front of your house is for transportation to and from your house and other houses in your neighborhood. Not as a place to park a hoop and have your kids play while inconveniencing others trying to drive through because you don't want to be bothered moving your cars onto the street.
djacks24
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 5:33 p.m.
Not in the street. Played most sports on grass in the yard. Basketball was either played at school, at the park, or at a friends house who had a better driveway for basketball than I had. But never in the street. Wasn't much of a basketball player anyway and I'm far from miserable.
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 3:53 p.m.
@djacks24 did you ever play basketball or hockey in the street as a youth or were you as miserable then as you are now?
ThaKillaBee
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:53 p.m.
It all made sense when I read John Hoops' name. Remember when he ran for supervisor and then blamed not getting elected on the voters' ignorance?
beardown
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:24 p.m.
Get the kids bikes and point them in the direction of a park. When I was a kid, which wasn't all that long ago, we just went park to park to get into games of differing skill levels. A street is for driving and parking. I guess when they slapped up that boring cookie cutter subdivision, they should have thought to put a park in there too.
glimmertwin
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:12 p.m.
If my kids were playing in the street or sidewalk and failed to allow pedestrians or vehicles pass, the $100 ticket would be the least of their problems. I guess it's too bad that others don't act the same way. There are already laws that could be used to penalize the offenders - not everyone. Another perfect example of government trying to be everyone's mommy and daddy.
Cash
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:21 p.m.
Well with the maturity displayed by MANY in society today, they NEED a mommy and daddy...because frankly most of us are sick of rude thoughtless behavior and the parents who condone it and the parents who ALSO display that behavior.
Cash
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:06 p.m.
'And Bryant added a final thought. "Why don't you guys put rims out at the park so the kids can play basketball there?" she asked' Why don't you go to a board meeting, and push this issue? It's a good one. But just expressing it to the media changes nothing. If you want positive change in the parks, ask for it from the folks with the power to make it happen!
Lauren Reed
Wed, Sep 4, 2013 : 7:38 p.m.
@TryingToBeObjective Two of her six are moved out with jobs. One is in college and has a job, one is in her Junior year of high school, the other two are under the age of 14. One works with his dad in the summer part-time. She takes her children on vacations, has them involved in sports and summer camp. It isn't wrong to let your kids outside in front of your house to play. They do not play in the street as you say, they play on the sidewalk and in the driveway, but apparently that is also a problem for some. Get your facts straight before speaking. As I said before, you probably don't know the Bryant family and therefore are making ill-informed statements.
YpsiGirl4Ever
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 2:16 p.m.
Greene Farms Park is a PRIVATE not Township Operated Park. If Bryant would like basketball hoops at the Park in Greene Farms, he would need to discuss this issue with the property developer or neighborhood watch group association,
Nicholas Urfe
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 1:54 p.m.
Maybe she could encourage her six kids to get involved in local government, and write some letters asking for hoops in the park.
TryingToBeObjective
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:37 p.m.
How many of Bryant's six kids are out of school? How many could get a job and be a productive member of society? Why isn't Bryant responsible for entertaining her six kids? When she moved there 10 years ago, did she do so because her six kids could play basketball in the street? Perhaps her kids could get involved in after school sports, as can all kids. Basketball is not a way of life, it's a hobby. If she wants to see her kids get ahead in life, perhaps it's time to start motivating them instead of blaming society because they can't play ball in the street.
Mike
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:04 p.m.
"But township officials say the ordinance is a result of years of complaints from neighborhood watch groups and residents about kids playing basketball in the street or right-of-way and not moving for traffic or pedestrians." Herein lies the problem...........when we played sports in the street growing up we were courteous enough to move out of the street momentarily when cars were coming. I have experienced kids glaring at me and basically daring me to continue driving through the street. I am totally against laws like this but it's not worth a confrontation with some of the kids who have created a necessity for a law like this. Sad reflection of our youth today.
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 3:59 p.m.
Your point is spot-on, just as a quote from the story read - this is a PEOPLE problem and instead of dealing with people, as is the norm for us in 2013, we legislate it out of sight and mind instead of dealing with people
Cash
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:07 p.m.
Even more sad that some adult(s) raised them to be like that.
Ignatz
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 11:27 a.m.
So, if kids don't get to play in the street, they'll start smoking pot?
Cash
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:12 p.m.
Ignatz, you didn't follow the premise to the conclusion? :-) Hmmm....me either. I was thinking they might sit down and set a logical plan to go to the township board to ask for a basketball court in the park. They just might get it!
jdmb03
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 11:09 a.m.
I would also like to thank Mr. Hoops and Ypsi Township for removing the basketball hoops from the sidewalks, nothing is more annoying than having to walk around objects blocking the sidewalks. Maybe now we can work on getting vehicles and boats clear of the sidewalks.
dading dont delete me bro
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 10:50 a.m.
there is an 'e' at the end of Greene in Greene Farms. in the article, it is spelled with and without.
greg s
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 10:49 a.m.
The street is not a play ground, besides the fact the noise is annoying. What a novel idea of a kid going to the park to play.
missmisery
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 11:03 a.m.
The park is to far away from Mom's fridge and some cold Sunny D.
tom swift jr.
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 10:49 a.m.
"Radzik also previously said the hoops are a safety issue. Hoops agreed." Ha!
lumberg48108
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 5:27 p.m.
only this was driven by community groups complaining about right of way - not safety adding on "safety" as an issue is self-serving with no basis in fact
Cash
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:17 p.m.
You have to admit the guy has a great name relative to this subject! Ha!!
drewblowsalot
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 10:26 a.m.
"Radzik also previously said the hoops are a safety issue" The only safety issue is John Hoops, the crotchety guy from Greene Farms that is making it more difficult for children to get excercise in their homes. I live in GF for 2 years and not once had an issue with children not moving when I pulled up in my car.
Cash
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 12:16 p.m.
That area has a great non-motorized path..... walk or run or skip or whatever. That's much better exercise than standing in an area shooting baskets.
jdmb03
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 11:05 a.m.
Mr. Hoops and the association have done many great things for GF.
Arieswoman
Tue, Sep 3, 2013 : 10:07 a.m.
A public street is no place for kids to play. To bad the subdivisions did not put in small courts for the kids to go play basketball. I have had to stop here in Ann Arbor for kids playing and refuse to get out of the roads!