Tim

Mon, May 16, 2011 : 8:49 p.m.

14'!

Roadman

Mon, May 16, 2011 : 2:48 a.m.

One of the goals of our criminal justice system is the deterrent factor. I believe that the filing of criminal charges against those against whom probable cause exists that a crime has been committed by that them should be done forthwith by the City Attorney. Those that are convicted should receive hefty fines and court costs as well as community service. The most egregious offenders should get 30 days in the Washtenaw County Jail and their names reported in local newspapers. This type of response by the city would ensure that this "tradition" ends forthwith. Future senior classes would realize that such conduct is not worth the risk of the severe punishment that could result. Think about it.

Randle Patrick

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 11:24 p.m.

honestlly, all you grownups just disgust me. These kids did not commit murder or acts of treason. They took a steamer on a field or vandalized tennis nets, and are getting punished accordingly. Does one night of bad decisions characterize them as bad kids? No. I would be willing to bet that a lot of the people who are calling for these adolescents heads are from the generation that swore to "never get old" and probably did much worse crimes than this. So please don't act like you are so much better than these teenagers. Secondly, why is it that our community cares so much more about 31 kids getting in trouble than it does about the budget cuts for the AAPS next year. If there were 259 comments about the school system, it might not be as in debt. Seriously adults, there are a lot bigger fish to fry than your thoughts on ways kids should be punished. Act your age, and forgive the kids instead of ostracizing them like they are serial killers.

Dexterdriver

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 11:19 p.m.

Regardless of whether all offending students heard the announcements from Principal White reminding them to use good judgement, etc., is it really a good argument from them that if they didn't hear clear directives not to do stupid things, it is somehow OK for them to do the crazy stuff they did? Give me a break. These are not children, strictly speaking, although their actions speak to the contrary.

Jon Saalberg

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 11 p.m.

@Freight Train: "The students I have taught that get busted for stuff like this usually have some correlative behavior that manifests itself as cheating/plagiarism, stealing or other dishonest behavior." I do not agree with this statement - am I to understand you believe only students who get caught are bad kids? I would argue they are just unfortunate, and perhaps unlucky in their proximity to Ann Arbor's finest at the time of the particular deeds. I know many kids who have actually grown up to be fine, upstanding adults, and they perpetrated some dumb things in their collective high school careers. What they all have in common is that they were never caught doing any of their misdeeds. I would gladly read any studies that support your assertion.

LB

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 10:59 p.m.

I hope they brought toilet paper with them.

longrun

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 8:43 p.m.

I am also a parent of a student who was suspended and I agree with many of the points raised in the comment by "dutch." To the best of my knowledge punishment has been doled out inconsistently, and the students were told one thing at the time of their confessions, and afterward, while different actions have subsequently been taken. Neither the students nor the parents have been fully informed about the criteria that were used to decide who would and who would not be punished. Critically, there appears to have been something inconsistent and maybe even arbitrary, in the way this has been handled. Unfortunately, this inconsistency has undermined the deeper lessons. Nevertheless, my child has accepted the consequences, and understands that apologies are in order and that such poor judgment and destructive acts deserve penalties. This is an unhappy way to end high school, but it has become even more unpleasant because of the perceived unfairness in how it was handled. I realize that life is not always fair, and that is also an important lesson to be learned, but a good faith effort to clarify the decision making process would be welcome. Clearly the whole affair has been an unfortunate situation for the PHS administration to deal with, and I realize with such a large scale problem it can be especially challenging to contend with so many voices, potentially differing accounts, and strong emotions. My thanks to Mr. White and his staff for their efforts to deal effectively with this situation. Perhaps the affected students and their parents can be further informed about the way the matter has been handled and how decisions were made, so that we can clear the air and move forward to truly celebrate the completion of high school by all members of the class of 2011.

dutch

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 7:29 p.m.

I am the parent of a child that was suspended and would like to clarify some of the misinformation. First, my child did not commit any vandalism but was on school property when others did and we agreed he should be punished. We were originally told that approximately 100 students were involved and all would receive the same punishment. We were also told that if one team member committed vandalism that entire team would be punished. We were informed by our child on Thursday of the punishment. We thought it was harsh but if all the guilty parties received the same punishment, then, it was fair. Imagine our surprise when we read in the Chicago Tribune that only 31 of the 100 students were punished. Not all of my child's team members were punished even though they were all explicitly named in the confessions they were required to write. When I questioned my child about this, I was told that the unpunished student was not the "type" to be punished. He also stated that one of the teams received no punishment even though they had damaged nets. So, do the math - six Huron nets were damaged, five student per team..Do you think all of the responsible students were punished? The response from the Pioneer administrators to our questions consisted of claims of still working on this, no knowledge (refer to written confessions) and we don't have any proof. Regarding the last excuse, many students were convicted based on what other students said they did. So, I am not sure why due process applies to some and not others. It seems to me this could have been a learning experience. Instead of harshly punishing a select few, perhaps all could have participated in correcting the wrong (i.e., retribuition and community service). Student who truly felt they were not guilty could certainly appeal. So, here is what my child learned: I overheard him talking to another punished student and said "we should have just lied"

Dexterdriver

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 4:13 p.m.

The poster "therealdeal" is apparently one of the many Pioneer kids who are too busy on their cellphones, or otherwise self absorbed during the school day to take in what is happening around them. Mr. White most assuredly did take time to speak to the school regarding inappropriate pranks and other activities which often occur at this time of the school year. I suggest unplugging your ears and pocketing the cell phones, my young friend!

winner

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 1:37 p.m.

real simple folks, a message to the social elite who think "not my child", YES your child!! and the reason your child acted the way they did, is because YOU act the way YOU do.

a2resa2

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 6:14 a.m.

I got suspended. I made a mistake and deserve and accept the punishment that i got. I think the school handled it pretty well. I would also like to point out that we arent criminals or future menaces to society, as some commenters say, just people that made a mistake and are being punished for it.

Kai Petainen

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 4:51 a.m.

When pranks turn from being pranks to national news, is that still a funny prank?

Dexterdriver

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 4:12 a.m.

As a PHS employee I can state for a fact that Mr. White, in P.A. announcements, several times warned the student body not to engage in illegal and dangerous activities as the school year draws to an end. He asked them to not let their judgement lapse and be drawn into behavior they knew was wrong. Granted, a lot of kids don't listen to any school announcements, or take them seriously, but one must credit Principal White with making a consistent, repeated effort to try to get it into these kids heads that they should practice good judgement and not do something dumb that could screw up the end of their Senior year and possibly impact their future negatively. Guess it's the old "you can lead a horse to water........"

Suit Hing Moy-Sandusky

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 3:38 a.m.

As a parent of a graduating senior, I am thankful that my child will no longer be subjected to this type of master discipline from a drill sergeant. Yes, I have had the pleasure of being on the receiving end of one of Mr. White's decisions which resulted in a 2 week suspension which was reduced to one after I discussed and prepared by child to defend herself against accusations and coercive tactics applied to affirm the suspension. As a parent, it is my responsibility to discipline and teach my children about their rights and also encourage them to be mature enough to make the right decisions and accept the punishment when they are wrong. What is troubling with this incident is the familiarity with how the facts seem to be presented, "10 or the 31 students were heavily involved" and the rest of the suspended students were either on the schools' property after driving the mischief-makers to the locations or were in the cars, which the district considered trespassing and grounds for suspension, Margolis said." We as parents (and I commend those who stepped forward) need to question whether their rights were violated when they were being questioned about the incident? Where the students coerced into admitting their participation? Let this be an opportunity for parents to become more involved with how these decisions are made and interview the kids and the parents to get a fair and equitable dialogue on how this decision was made regarding the fines, punishment and lessons learned. Congratulations to all the seniors and the best of luck in your future endeavors.

Meral

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 2:55 a.m.

We have gone way too easy on the student population. It is a shame students of Pioneers High School feels they have to do something to other schools that they are superiors to other schools. The board of education of Michigan having such a hard time with the recent cuts all across the board, we do not need any waste this time or any other. I'd say make them pay for all the distraction and some community work. And for all the people are objecting the penalty, I'll tell them to teach some responsibly to your children. There should be no tolerance. We the tax payers would feel good about it if they have learned their lessons. We deserve better attitude from our beloved kids.

Cendra Lynn

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 2:30 a.m.

Anger has no place in education. Hearing that the principal got angry with a student makes me wonder about the whole system. Adult anger is very frightening to children. Decades of study have shown punishment does not teach nor does it deter future similar behavior. If the adults cannot control themselves, I don't want them trying to educate our children. Clearly Pioneer's adults are out of control with the obvious results with the students. This is why my eldest daughter helped found alternative education here in A2 and why my youngest was never allowed to even visit a public school. Thanks to home schooling and many adults who behaved as adults, she finished high school and went on to win awards and honors at college. What is really sad is reading comments that indicate total lack of sympathy for the children and sadistic delight that students are getting "a wakeup call."

mohomed

Sun, May 15, 2011 : 1:22 a.m.

Good thing these pampered rich kids didn't come to the streets of Ypsi and do this. Maybe there parents should get there taxes raised to even out the disparity of Ypsi and Ann Arbor and be equal creating more hope and change for my community which the privledged like to call the ghetto but what I call home.

Ellen

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:25 p.m.

Wooohooo, now this story is on the front page of FoxNews.com. I used this story to remind my young children that it's NEVER ok to destroy property, even if your friends are doing it. They kinda rolled their eyes at me, but it's obvious that parents must have to *specifically* teach kids not to do stuff like this. I also think all these arguments of "oh well at least no one got hurt or killed" are so lame. Really? So it's all good as long as no one dies? How about teaching the future of this country a little respect and self-control instead of enabling and rationalizing?

Mike Doohickey

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:17 p.m.

Now it's National news...

Awakened

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:16 p.m.

People get paid good money to do stupid stunts like this on MTV, Spike and TMZ. People post this stuff to youtube. It is outrageous that they punish kids for doing what they have been taught. Suspend the administrators of public schools for failing to teach public virtue and duty!!

jcj

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 9:50 p.m.

It has been stated that there were no announcements warning that the hunt was unacceptable. Can anyone verify that there were announcements made?

EyeHeartA2

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 8:53 p.m.

@Aaron Rosano : You are right, I am sure. So, I am also sure that you will have no problems writing down these exploits on one of your college entrance essays. I mean, you are proud of it right? After seeing your attitude, I have really reversed my position on this. Yesterday, I was in your court. Today, I see that all the posters declaring the students spoiled entitled brats may have been correct.

Barbara Clarke

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 8:32 p.m.

The students' behavior is pretty disappointing. One would expect better conduct from young people who are fortunate enough to attend an Ann Arbor high school. Yes, punishment is in order. School administration earned their salaries this week.

Brosano

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 8:22 p.m.

First of all, Mr. EyeHeartA2 or whatever...Its not a matter of whether or not my personal GPA affects my criminal status, its a matter of the fact that my GPA and high school status reflects that in societies eyes i am a "good" person. I continue to see comments that "good" kids wouldn't do stuff like this.

rossjohnson

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 8:16 p.m.

The scavenger hunt is done in teams, and if one person on a team was found to have done something bad, everyone on the team would be suspended. One team had 5 people suspended even though only 2 people participated in the vandalism.

Lovaduck

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 8:05 p.m.

I'm so sick of all this "it's no big thing---kids will be kids" commentary from overly indulgent Ann Arborites. In my day, though I'm an old poop, to be sure, these kids would have been suspended and their graduation would have been in doubt. We wonder when we have such a narcissistic society with a ghastly sense of entitlement. Judging from these comments -- and the accusations of "self-righteousness" of any who disagrees, we can easily see why. Actions have consequences; you'll never teach responsibility with simple proverbial "slaps on the wrist with a wet noodle." No, don't ruin lives; but us this to teach persons to mature, rather than provide indulgent excuses for bad behavior.

AAmom

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:53 p.m.

I think all of the students who are guilty but are staying quiet should turn themselves in on Monday.

listen

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:53 p.m.

Did those of you who feel it necessary to point out how rotten the 31 kids are and how enabling their parents are actually read the two articles written on the Pioneer suspension subject? 10 out of the 31 suspended were actually guilty of vandalism, the other 21 were guilty of trespassing. According to AAPS, that leaves another 219 students who didn't do anything. They have no actual proof of this, it really means nobody rolled over on those kids. The kids that are in trouble incriminated themselves while being questioned by their principle. The issue being brought forward by some of the parents is about the method with which these incriminating statements were taken. Multiple students have said that their principle is terrifying. Their statements were wrung out of them while they were being accused of lying and threatened with jail time. It appears that bullying is not tolerated for students but is not only tolerated but condoned for adminisration. Those of you who are so ready to protect the principle would feel very differently if your own child was the one who had been confined to the office, interrogated at length and then forced to write a statement. Threatening kids with jail without due process is illegal as are statements that have been coerced and written under duress. There is no such thing as accessory to vandalism. Adults have more rights in our legal system than these kids were afforded in their own school. What some of these students did is wrong and should be punished properly by the court system, not by a principle who has set himself up as judge and jury. The others are guilty only of stupidity as apparently are many in our community.

Tyler

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:50 p.m.

'12!

G2inA2

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:31 p.m.

Heck, when I was in HS, the "senior prank" consisted of putting the school for sale in the newspaper-- i.e., "indoor swimming pool, gym, outdoor tennis courts, plenty of parking, perfect for teens!" and then the schools office number in the paper. Ah yes, it was a crazy morning for the secretary, but still, totally FUNNY and not at all destructive! Unfortunately, when I was teaching at the rival school, rats were let loose in the halls (gross to others and unfair to the rats), a bunch of crickets let loose in the hall, also gross. Come on--let's get a hold of these disgusting pranks. To me, the kids got off very easily. And the comments that these were "good kids" is a joke. A "good kid" KNOWS this was wrong.

Gary Lillie

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:22 p.m.

To me, Michelle Kaucheck is one of the problems. The students were punished fairly, but an adult is trying to make the student feel like a victim. There is too much of that in this society. Too much disrespect, too. This country lost much in the 1960s - '70s with all of the anti-everything, destruction of property, mocking of anything with values and contempt for laws. What else would you expect from young people? They have been told that those days meant "involvement," not lack of character. BTW - I did dumb things when I was younger and can't say I have been perfect since, but I learned that when you face the consequences, hard as it is to admit, there is nobody to blame but yourself. I also learned that one should never be too hard on oneself; we were not planned as perfect beings.

Brosano

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:16 p.m.

IMPORTANT NOTICE.... sorry for the caps lock but as a student who got suspended for "malicious acts of destruction" against "rival schools," i want to make something very clear to all of you who have absolutely no idea what actually went on. I see many comments like, "250 kids participated and only 31 got suspended for destruction that must mean that 220 of of those kids were smart enough and good enough not to do those things." Get out your head dude. For real. Before you make judgments get your facts straight. First of all, most of the 31 kids that got suspended didn't do anything illegal. They were merely in the car when one of their stupid friends decided to go do something. Do you expect me to get out of the car and beat up my friend so he wont go poop on a field? No. And you wouldnt either. Or maybe you would suggest getting a cork for their butt...Hmmmm. I don't know how appealing that sounds. I would also like to mention that Mr. White never made a single announcement about the senior scavenger hunt. Even at this assembly we had that was supposed to be warning us about drinking before prom, they never mentioned a single word about the scavenger hunt. At least to my knowledge. And as a student with a 3.8 GPA who has never been in trouble with the school for his entire career there, i think my "knowledge" is pretty reasonable and trustworthy. In case any of you don't know, or fail to realize. About one fourth (which is one member of a group of four or five that were assigned for the hunt) of the kids who took part i the hunt decided to do something illegal to one of the "rival high schools." They were not only the easiest pranks to conduct but they were also worth some of the most points on the list. In my panel of about 17 students that got called down to the office to be suspended, I could see and point out at least 10 who i know didn't do anything at all and i could also INSTANTLY find and point out about 150

AlwaysLate

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 7:09 p.m.

My senior year we swiped the Big Boy statue from in front of the Big Boy restaurant (this was before they started bolting them down) and dropped it into the deep end of the high school swimming pool. We got yelled at...but, none of this overreaction (It's on Foxnews.com now...). Last summer, for our 40th high school reunion, we did the same thing (Getting the bolts undone was tough!). This time it was in the newspaper. But, no one got arrested.

trespass

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 6:22 p.m.

For those who have said that turning this over to the police would automatically end in the courts are not aware of a Michigan law known as the juvenile diversion act. It allows the police to investigate but divert the offender into alternatives to the court system such as releasing the offender to their parents punishment. That would allow the professionals to interrogate but not result in arrests or courts.

Nerak

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 5:57 p.m.

I think it's completely inappropriate for these students to participate in any graduation activities, not just the all-night party. They clearly do not respect the school or its officials, so why should they be allowed to stand up with all the students who didn't pull this stupid stunt?

Jon Saalberg

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 5:25 p.m.

It's unfortunate that so many people have forgotten what it's like to be a teenager. And it's unfortunate that so many have a "holier than thou" attitude about these events. These are NOT adults. They are kids. Why does our society perpetuate the idea that teenagers should be treated as adults, thought their decision making processes are hardly adult-like. As one intimately acquainted with the criminal justice system, the calls for harsh punishments are ludicrous - that is just what the Washtenaw County criminal justice needs - hundreds of trivial (compared to the majority of cases in the criminal justice system, these deeds are trivial) cases clogging up the courts. I fear this is the result of going to a school where plainclothes police routinely roust students - it creates an environment of presumed guilt and distrust, not one of learning. It's no wonder young people are cynical - they hear adults telling them to believe in "the system", yet see it treat them with suspicion.

AAmom

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 5:06 p.m.

LOOK!! (I'm yelling at all of you!) No one died, No one was in a serious automobile accident. No one is severely-mildly permanently or temporarily injured. That is something to BE THANKFUL FOR. Everyone is alive... I am sorry, but I would rather have a HS senior who made a terrible mistake and is paying the consequences than a child in the hospital. Please put this in perspective, everybody and resume your lives...and be a little kinder to someone today.

a2love

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 4:46 p.m.

This is an annual event for Pioneer students and if you think because of what happened this year it won't happen again next year your wrong! When I was in high school at Pioneer we did many illegal things during the senior scavenger hunt, so am I a criminal? No, I graduated from a distinguished university and now teach many of your children in Ann Arbor. Do I think they should quit the scavenger hunt? Nope! Keep it going, it's part of the tradition, they just can't get caught! I'd say hide it more from the staff, not everyone can know about it so far in advance. Thats how problems start. Defacing property at each others schools is also a tradition. A good one? probably not, a funny one? heck yeah! Huron will do the same darn thing to pioneer, heck huron will poop on their own cops car! Senior pranks will continue, at this point seniors don't care, they want to leave a legacy and let me tell you as a teacher this time a year all we do is talk about our favorite senior pranks and who did them. Saline had pranks yesterday and they will continue for the students last two weeks and yes there were even suspensions! Skyline juniors are already planning their pranks for next year realizing they have to make the first ones as big as possible...pioneer is just giving them ideas. And those river rats will be at it shortly as well. I am sure not all 31 students suspended were involved and I feel for them. I've heard many things about Mr. White, I'm just glad he wasn't around when I was there. Seems like he's made the school a prison from what current students say. Yeah they should clean up what they did, but yes they should also be able to walk and probably even go to the all night party, the biggest reason being so they aren't out drinking and driving that night. People who think the police should be involved and the court system are out of line more than these seniors were!

geijin

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 4:24 p.m.

Not all of the 31 students being punished took part in the illegal activities. Many of those 200+ not suspended did take part in the illegal activities. This does not seem right to me. Clearly, some students lied about their participation and have avoided the punishment. Mr. White and Mr. Hudson used bullying techniques (yelling, pounding on tables, calling students liars, etc.) not consistent with published AAPS bullying standards to get students to rat on others and to write statements under duress. Their methods clearly are not examples I would want any student to learn from. Their actions need to be investigated. This is a matter for the legal system not the school system. Due process was hardly provided to these students. I happen to be a parent of one of the suspended students whom I believe is innocent of any vandalism but guilty of poor judgment. I have asked Mr. White to call me via a telephone request, a hand-written note delivered to his office and another document delivered to his office so that I can see the specific charges, evidence, etc. to convince me otherwise He has chosen not to respond. That makes me believe that he does not have any proof that would withstand the scrutiny of a non-professional cursory review, let alone a formal legal process. If the AAPS system is trying to make examples out of the group of 31 guilty and innocent students, then instead of stating the AAPS system is trying to protect these students by keeping the issue internal, I think this should be a case for the police. This annual ritual has gone on for many years and will only grow if only a few students are punished by being given a week off of school and many of the guilty students miss punishment altogether.

Kai Petainen

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 4:23 p.m.

I'm hearing more that people broke into the stadium. Did DPS show up? If not, then why not? Wouldn't that be a security breach? Or is it quite common that people go in after hours? If DPS showed up, then why don't I see it in the daily police reports? Am I looking in the wrong spot? Was it conveniently not reported?

aaum5

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 4:20 p.m.

As a student who was suspended, I just want to point out that it is primarily the community's adults who are creating this unfortunate incident into a dramatic spectacle. The students care, they understand that they have broken the law and must receive punishment. Even I, who did not trespass onto Skyline of Huron's property, am accepting my punishment because I was aware of the crimes being committed. But we are are all trying to face our punishments with a little dignity, and not make such a ruckus about it. Those who are commenting should realize that almost all of the 250 students committed crimes on public property, what distinguishes them from the 31 suspended students is that they were not on Ann Arbor Public Schools property. Many of these comments are quite patronizing, and very generalized. I do not appreciate being lumped with the 3 or 4 kids who may have actually defecated on public property. All I'm saying is that it would be nice to see a little sensitivity in these comments. You may judge me as a "bad kid" and say that staying in the car is just as bad as pooping on a field, but I know the truth. The entire senior class was fully aware that illegal activities would be taking place that Thursday night, and yet only about 4% are facing the punishment. Please remember, we are not making excuses, but peer pressure is a powerful force, and most of these kids, including myself, are ashamed of how they are being viewed.

say it plain

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 4:18 p.m.

I can't believe people are so down on Michael White. What a terrible situation he had to deal with. Yes, he could have concluded that since the worst of the moral-less lot will lie the best and there might be thusly relative 'innocents' serving suspensions instead, there is just "nothing he can do". I guess this must be how a lot of the parents of kids at this school treat their kids. I think he should just cancel the all-night party because these crappy-thinking Pioneers decided to crap on the other schools and thusly they 'represented' faultily, criminally, and won't even admit who did what. I think he should make the *whole senior class* do 20 hours of community service at their school and at the other two schools...*AFTER* school hours while Pioneer teachers and parents and staff get to supervise those hours. If he holds that "threat" out, then either the crew of truly 'responsible' little infants will 'fess up, or else the senior class can really work out those 'problems' they've been having with knowing how to act with each other and with their neighbors. To do nothing because we can't figure out exactly who did what is just not right. Sorry for the kids at Pioneer who have to live with such students in their presence, but to let this attitude keep on keeping on is a disservice to everyone in the AAPS, and it seems to me that Michael White is trying to change the nasty culture at the school. The leaders at the other schools in town should expect that from him, as well.

LindaE

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 3:45 p.m.

It is time that students learn that fun does not involve taking things that are not yours. Or messing up something that is not yours. These are lessons that should have been learned in Kindergarten.

David Torres

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 3:37 p.m.

I'm just wondering how many Michigan fans here would gladly poop on Ohio States or Michigan States fifty yard line. How many Michigan Fans would gladly deface something at their stadium if they could.

BhavanaJagat

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 3:33 p.m.

It really surprises me to read about the number of students that were involved in these pranks. I would like to know a little more about the money that the School District spends on its security arrangements. If not Police, the Security person must have detected and directly intervened to stop this activity before it escalated. This is public property where public, and students are not allowed on the property including the grounds after 10 P.M. unless there is an official function. It would be the right thing to do; issue citations to all the students who had entered the School grounds after the buildings are closed. Students must learn the rules of the game. They must know the City Ordinance and must learn to live by rules if they want to attend College.

alternativeview99

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 3:30 p.m.

Hmmm... I guess I wonder why the school officials didn't take a more active role in working with students to see that the list of items were all harmless pranks Instead, their solution seemed simply to say "no". The same sort of thing happened in my school a long time ago. It ended in disaster as well. While the administration was saying we could not have our senior prank day, a batch of angry kids planned to go ahead and do something on their own. Added to a list where the most harmful item was simply taking the steps to the portable classrooms and putting them on top of the rooms so it would delay classes by 5 or 10 minutes Monday morning, were more malicious items such as painting the parking lot with anti-principal slogans, letting loose a batch of frogs down the administration wing, and some graffiti in the admin bathroom that wasn't very pleasant I heard. And, many students like myself stayed clear of the party because it had taken on a malicious flavor. And, we mourned the loss of a day of fun.

Tyler Waldrop

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 3:21 p.m.

I'm a student at Pioneer High School, therefore I know MANY of the students that participated in the senior scavenger hunt, suspended or not. There was obviously some gross, malicious acts of vandalism that occurred, but only a few (reported as 10) of the 31 students suspended were involved in those activities. Although "the list" had way too many illegal items on it, there were also a lot of items that weren't illegal, that most of the students did instead of the illegal ones. Should a spectator or someone waiting in the car really get the same punishment? The kids that waited in the car knew some of the activities were wrong and didn't want to be involved, and weren't. Mr. White needs to give people fair and just punishments, not give everyone the same punishment. Mr. White threatened kids, telling them that if their parents contested the suspensions, he would not allow them to walk at graduation. Does he really have the right to keep anyone from exercising their right of due process? There was a lot that happened here that most of the people who commented know nothing about. I am not excusing the behavior of the 10 kids that did these activities, but not all of the 31 deserve the full punishment, which was a 5 day suspension, 2 week athletic suspension, no senior all night party, 10 hours of community service, and restitution for damages they didn't participate in. Mr. White and the superintendent ignored the facts and punished everyone the same. That's just wrong!

Townie

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 3:15 p.m.

How about the administration, advisors, parents and students demonstrating good public behavior by doing a community service type 'scavenger hunt'. We have tons of neglected public property in need of some TLC. Maybe plant some trees around the Pioneer grounds, etc.? We have many senior citizens whose homes need fixing as well. I realize it's not as much fun as destroying things but at least the students could see trees growing, a better looking community as they grow older (and hopefully more mature). We need to stop calling out and out destructive vandalism as 'pranks', etc. It's not funny or creative, just destruction for the fun of it and where other people have to clean up the mess.

nbishar

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 2:42 p.m.

really? you know what would've happened if this happened a generation ago, ill tell you nothing. when did we become such prudes that kids cant even pull off pranks, granted they may have been malicious, but i think that most people have forgotten how the youth thinks, let them pay the fine make them do community service but dont kick them out of the senior all night party. plus the whole point of the senior all night party is to keep the kids from doing stupid things the night of their graduation. Now the people who have been proven to do stupid things are going to back on the streets the night of their graduation. where would you rather them be?

EyeHeartA2

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 2:24 p.m.

I was actually on the side of these kids yesterday. Kids will be kids. Don't wreck their life blah, blah, blah. The other part of that is: Take responibilty for your actions. Say you're sorry. Say you won't do it again. THANK MR WHITE for cutting you a break. This whiney garbage makes me want to throw the book at them. I feel Mr. White showed remakable restraint under the circumstances. You parents running to cover up. YOU are the reason this city makes me throw up in my mouth a little. Entititled crap from entitled people. Too bad you bred.

InterestedReader

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 2:18 p.m.

Let's think about this. The type of person that would defecate in public. Would this person either lack good judgment or be aggressive and violent? Would this type of person run over ducklings with a large vehicle? I can't help but see the similarities.

tom d

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 2:18 p.m.

'11!

lumberg48108

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 2:12 p.m.

with a click-click here and a click-click there, .com got exactly what it wanted of this minor vandalism story it got LEGS to run more stories the next day and get more comments (from suckers like me) when u send away your journalists and hite teenagers and stay at home moms tto wrote your stories and gwhat few editors you have are presussured to increase clicks, you get a second story like today that shed no new light on anything

SonnyDog09

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:55 p.m.

If they had turned the students over to the police, that would have resulted in an increase in crime. Hizzoner has decreed that crime will be reduced in the People's Democratic Republic of Ann Arbor.

Pika

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:54 p.m.

As a teacher at a local school (not Pioneer) I am left wondering what these kids actually learned? If they learned that this behavior was in any way excusable, their schooling has failed them. I feel sorry for these stupid kids but I do believe they should be punished rather severely. I don't think the obvious leaders should walk at graduation - sorry kids, but there is a line and you crossed it.

Kai Petainen

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:40 p.m.

One of the comments earlier made mention that something may have happened at the stadium. But, when I look through the DPS daily beat reports, I don't see any indication of that. So.... where is the disconnect? Did something happen, or not?

dexterreader

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:36 p.m.

These are students who are, or will soon be, 18 years old .... the "legal age" for many things. They are old enough to know better. Celebrating one's graduation from high school does not give one the right to do illegal things. Last time I checked, damaging others' property was not legal. You break the rules, you pay the consequences. It's very simple. And if one was my child (and I do have a child graduating this year), and he didn't pay the consequences at school, you can bet he'd pay them at home .... and they would be far worse.

S_A2

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:32 p.m.

If the school bans an annual activity that's "mostly harmless fun", what's left becomes illegal and out of control. I would still like to think that kids can tell what' goes over the line, though. Guess this was a sharp learning curve.

Major

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:32 p.m.

What a waste of time, money, resource's, a non story. How does this crap even make it in the news...who cares?

A2rez

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:06 p.m.

If they sent the kids to the court system, it would come out that they didn't get the worst offenders - or even many of the offenders. Several of the kids being punished would receive little to no punishment in the system, as many of them played very minor roles. Kaucheck is right in that many of the kids being punished are paying restitution for damage they had no part of - or even knowledge of. I've read a number of comments about these kids having parents who protect them. In fact, many of the worst offenders who did the most damage (and whose names were also given to school officials) are the kids with powerful parents, and these are the kids getting off completely free.

A2Realilty

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:02 p.m.

I'm amazed at how many people leaving comments have apparently lived an angelic life and walk around daily with their halos sparkling in the sun. I think that the punishments are about right. Some improvements, in my opinion, would be to 1) Take the $10 participation fee that the students all put into the pot and put it toward recuperating the damages; 2) Make the community service go toward fixing the damages; 3) Make all 5 of the days for which the students are suspended be spent doing community service; 4) Make all 250 participants perform a minimum of 4 hours of community service. All that being said, these kids are 17 and 18. I know several of them well. The ones that I know are all in good academic standing and are going to great colleges. I think that everyone posting on here needs to take their blinders off and remember the mistakes that we all made when we were at that age. The kids involved should be punished, but please stop implying that they (or their parents) represent the devil's spawn.

Gramma

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 1:01 p.m.

Let's see. Over 250 students participated. Only 31 participated in the destruction. That means over 200 students had the maturity and insight not to participate in destructive acts. These were the "good kids," not the still immature young people who seem to believe that their actions should not have consequences. It conflicts with all the statements that we are all so immature and self centered at this age. The 31 deserve the consequences they are receiving. The others deserve compliments that they did not participate in this part of the scavenger hunt.

15crown00

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 12:45 p.m.

kids were idiots and of course the very PC parents support their kids and not the school administration.SUCH IS LIFE THESE DAYS.

BioWheels

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 12:40 p.m.

Students that commit these kinds of acts should not be allowed to walk in graduation, and should have to pay the same consequences that anyone else would - including any criminal charges. If criminal charges result in the loss of a diploma or acceptance into a college, then so be it. I really don't want students that commit vandalism and other criminal acts to represent the Ann Arbor community when they go on to a major college or university. Why should they be able to represent the school and the community by walking in a ceremony that represents what they have learned and their transition into the "real" world! Let's not blame the administrators - put the responsibility where it belongs - on the students that committed these acts!

ummsw

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 12:40 p.m.

If this vandalism had been turned over to the police and courts consequences would have been more severe. There are consequences for every choice you make life....Hurt someone say"Your Sorry" break or cause destruction.."replace it"..take the punishment, move forward..hopefully a lesson is learned and it will carry you through the rest of your life.

northshoreburbguy

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 12:32 p.m.

Two comments. 1st, this is a poorly written article. Michelle Kaucheck references a statement -- in fact "her statement" -- but she is neither a parent nor a student. Why did she write a statement? Prior to this comment, there is no explanation about the statements. I finally concluded she was referring to the students' statements. Second, if Michelle Kaucheck knows that other students were involved, how is she helping the administration? She is quick to criticize but offers no suggestions, alternatives or additional information. It's easy being a side-line critic.

Buster W.

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 12:24 p.m.

In my opinion, the 10 hours of community service should be completed at Skyline and Huron. Why should Pioneer receive the benefit of community service???

jcj

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 12:12 p.m.

It would be helpful in making this a complete story if a2.com would publish a list of all of the things on the scavenger list. Or maybe just the things that might not be so offensive.

Davidian

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:53 a.m.

Poop is the line you just don't cross.

Basic Bob

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:48 a.m.

The students that were caught on Huron and Skyline property should serve their in-school suspensions and community service at Huron and Skyline dressed proudly in Pioneer t-shirts. They should not receive their diploma or transcripts until all the graffiti is removed. Michael White is attempting to make the punishment appropriate but avoid the criminal justice system. Any parent that attempts to support, protest, or interfere should be informed that their case will be referred to the police for investigation and possible prosecution.

Dr. I. Emsayin

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:40 a.m.

Everyone so interested in this should also be reading about the budget at AAPS with equal interest.

DennisP

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:32 a.m.

I usually look to Don Bee for good comments and I agree again with what he said regarding distinguishing between harmless fun and destructive behavior. As for the nature of punishment, we can all have an opinion on what we'd do and like to se, but the responsibility for that decision rested with the principal and I think he approached it as a principal should. With a measure of reason yet drawing the line. For those who think that this principal went too far or needs anger management, let me just say that yesterday's comment board was full of comments demanding criminal accountability from those 31. The principal could have easily just turned it over to police and let them do all the "interrogation". These kids would need a lawyer to try to withdraw their statements of confession then, not a neighbor. It's clear that these kids are feeling the punishment and will come to regret this action as they grow older and mature. But, I also bet that in years to come they will, in the back of their minds, thank this principal for taking a reasoned and measured response to their antics that demanded just accountability rather than vengefully letting them get dragged through the court systems and have their lives and reputations marred--all at great taxpayer expense. Hopefully, that's another important lesson they will carry with themselves throughout their lives.

rossjohnson

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:19 a.m.

The senior scavenger hunt is NOT a senior prank, messing with athletic stuff at other schools is a prank. This article is misleading

Omega Man

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 11:05 a.m.

Just read some of the comments in the prior article - I am concerned that an accurate tally of destruction has not been completed. Replacing wind screens at the Tennis courts at Huron and repairing other damage, repairing defaced stop signs, removing spray paint from electronic signage, etc. sounds like more than $2,700 to me. Make sure that you have an accurate accounting before confirming grades to colleges or generating diplomas, otherwise you won't get the $s. This is public property.

trespass

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:59 a.m.

I think the Principal needs some anger management classes. He isn't a trained interrogator. Who knows if these confessions are true? It seems like he needed to punish somebody in order to deter this from happening again but it didn't really matter if he got the right students.

DonBee

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:59 a.m.

"Most of the activities were harmless fun" Yes, those are not the ones that are the problem. It is the ones that were not harmless fun that were the problem. I think the ring leaders should serve an in school suspension in a place where they can be seen and with no access to cell phones, laptop, books or other entertainment. After a day, they should be offered a chance to "work off the suspension" cleaning up. The same should go for the rest of the 31. If the juniors realize there are limits, maybe it will not be repeated again for a couple of years. It is just sit home for 5 days, then it will repeat next year. Afterall, this is get out of class and goof off at the end of senior year - why would it not grow next year?

a2grateful

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:55 a.m.

More fault finding in comments? "It's the students . . . It's the parents . . . It's the school system . . . It's society . . . It's the lack of fiber in our diets . . . It's too much fiber in our diets . . ." Hmmm . . . I am grateful that all of the kids made it home safely that night . . . If this is the worst graduation-related story we see, then we are very fortunate . . . All of the kids get to live another day . . . and have a chance to become as perfect as their detractors . . .

smokeblwr

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:55 a.m.

I'm just amazed somebody dropped a grumpy on the football field. I think that sounds like a cry for help from the young people of Ann Arbor. How have we failed them?!?!?

Maggie Levenstein

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:46 a.m.

This headline is irresponsible. Most of the activity in the senior scavenger hunt is harmless and fun. Headlines like this are about self-righteousness, or the desire to create scandal and controversy, rather than support young people, including young people doing silly and unproductive things. If the local newspaper, such as it is, can't distinguish between something fun and something destructive, how are the kids supposed to learn to?

Chip Reed

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:44 a.m.

"officials spoke with student athletes...". It does seem like jocks misbehave more than nerds or hippies. For some "scholar-athletes", high school is the pinnacle of their existence, so perhaps it is their last chance to try to get away with stuff.

tom swift jr.

Sat, May 14, 2011 : 10:25 a.m.

You know what happens when an article gets over 200 comments on aa.com? You run an article about the same thing the next day... those ad hits are like gold! And, what does "they didn't feel they had any other choice but to confess when they were questioned by White and other school officials." even mean? Of course they had options, they could have lied, a much more logical route for someone who doesn't want the world to know they defecated on a public school athletic field. And, last comment, if you want to know what type of student would take part in a prank like this, it's the type that has some adult always willing to say "awwww....poor you! It's not your fault, it's those bad adults at your school." Sorry, can't feel bad for these kids, I hope this is a wakeup call for them and they've learned that most of the people in our culture don't defecate in public and destroy property just for fun.