Tru2Blu76

Wed, Apr 25, 2012 : 4:34 a.m.

100% factual: TWO ideological groups are behind the drive to make women subservient to the law (and thereby to the will of SOME men). One is the Catholic religion and the other is the Conservative Movement. Not coincidence: The Conservative Movement's primary instrumentality is the Republican Party which is composed of factions ranging from the relatively mild and non-threatening to the Catholic population and on to far-right extremists who declare themselves "beyond" government control as "sovereign individuals" AND such other "religious leaders" as the late David Koresh. FACT: without these "conservative factions," the Republican Party would go extinct because no average person (who hasn't been manipulated) would believe in the elitist, male-dominated "intentions" & actions of that party. In short, Ms. Kelly: tell it to the Republicans and the Conservative Movement which the party shelters and promotes - in exchange for money and votes. But please don't generalize about "men" with negative intent. And tell it to every Catholic (of either gender) you meet: they honestly believe that abortion is murder, ignoring that all but a few ova are expelled and killed naturally by women's bodies. They honestly believe they're policing and controlling women because God wants them to. Tell the Vatican to reign in its dogma dogs in this country.

eagleman

Sun, Apr 22, 2012 : 9:52 p.m.

In a marriage both people have the "right" to let the other know what is best for the family. A person loses their individuality when they become part of a larger group. You have to subsume your ego and concerns for the good of the group. This is a basic element of groups that even animals understand. What I ironic here is that many women often tell their mates what to do. Women are notoriously controlling because they, like lionesses, are in charge of running the day-to-day operation of the family. Ask most married men who is in charge and they will say their wife. They'll also tell you, in secret of course, that they resent being controlled. I sympathize with her demand that she rejects being told what to do, but she and every other wife or mother ought to understand that they themselves may be seen as doing what they are railing against. A family is best when it is ran as a dual monarchy with a dash of democracy thrown in as the young age.

joe.blow

Sun, Apr 22, 2012 : 12:38 p.m.

I've come to realize that I should tell me wife nothing and Ignore everything she tells me to do. Women think that men try to control them, ultimately women don't try to control men, they just do!

Dcam

Sun, Apr 22, 2012 : 11:28 a.m.

A DISCUSSION ON WOMAN'S RIGHTS. Gentleman: "A—I've no doubt you're quite right in Theory, Lady Hypatia. But I'm afraid that in Practice the World at large won't agree with you." Lady Hypatia: "Won't it? Then it oughtn't to be at large!" Punch, Dec 1893

Polyjuce123

Sun, Apr 22, 2012 : 1:14 a.m.

As a once stay at home DAD, i find Mrs Kelly's opinion to shaped more by her very apparent negative experiences with men in her own life, rather than how the majority of men really are. Many men choose (some get forced) to be stay at home parents as well, but do not receive the attention and understanding that women do. Married myself, I cannot imagine ever telling my wife she has do anything, instead I support her decisions no matter what they are. Mrs Kelly's opinions go well beyond the realm of being just an "opinion", and simply shed light on her apparent poor personal relationship. Yep, all men are scum.

alex

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 9:58 p.m.

then men need to stop women what they can or can't do with their bodies!

Thaddeus

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 9:57 p.m.

Wasn't mostly men who voted for things like the 19th Amendment? Title IX? Pay Equity? Laws that not only protect, but increasingly favor women in the paid work sphere, the home, the Courts, and relationships....? I wasn't a male politician who had the opportunity to make thoe pieces of legislation possible by voting for them. I just vote for politicians that seem the most supportive of womens' autonomy and rights. But as a man very much supportive of gender equality, I find the tone of the writer very offensive. I guess progressive men can/ could have allowed the elements that still believe women should have no say on anything in or outside the house or paid workforce have their way. If it weren't for a lot of men saying that it IS a good idea for women to pursue higher levels of education, write letters to the editor, etc., the writer Ms. Kelly wouldn't have had a forum for her anti-men rant.... The tone of this writer is a good example of not throwing the baby out with the bath water, or biting the hand that feeds you, etc....

Unusual Suspect

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 8:17 p.m.

When a woman can back a trailer down a boat ramp and write her name in the snow as wall as I can, then we can talk.

superhappyfunbrett

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 8:13 p.m.

Beyond all encompassing statements and apparent rage... I think I see a small point, and I think I agree with that small little angle. In that, people who aren't in a specific demographic might not be the best people (or first people) you want to hear from concerning that specific demographic's issues. Women should be vocal and in control of themselves as individuals, etc. It's also nice to see unity among females, especially when it's concerning issues that are rooted strongly to their gender. Having said that, telling men to "back off" is odd to me. Perhaps not the best way to communicate what I'm assuming (hoping) is your (partial) point. Because telling all of us to "back off" is ridiculous, in my opinion. There are plenty of men who support positivity and fairness for the women in their lives, and women in general. Not all men are clueless; not all men are controlling. Add to this the fact that... certain issues that impact women can ALSO greatly impact men, and well... we should be trying to work TOGETHER on those such issues. I know making blanket statements about entire groups of people is a popular thing to do, but it doesn't really help solve any troubles in this world. I'd rather people come together and work towards a solution oppose to everyone "backing off" from each other. Depending on the issue, let the proper people take the lead. But that doesn't mean we all can't help make things better. That's my take.

Unusual Suspect

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 7:55 p.m.

To say stay-at-home parents (doesn't have to be the mom, of course) don't get paid is shortsighted. There might not be dollars received due to the investment, but there will be payment in other forms: a closer relationship with the kids, less television watched, fewer video games played, more homework done, better grades, better-behaved kids, and fewer of the after-school empty-house problems that teems often get into (drugs, pregnancy, etc). Contrary to the selfish message in this opinion piece, this is a decision to be made by the husband and wife together. Wealth isn't just about how big a pile of cash you can build, but also about the quality of life of children, and having parent at home contributes to that. Most couple who say they can't afford to have one parents stay at actually can, but it takes a compromise in the area of lifestyle. You have to decide you don't need two $30,000 cars, and new ones every two years, a membership at the club, a lake-front cottage up north, a European vacation every summer, season tickets to the games, etc. I will agree most people can't afford those things and a parent at home. It all comes down to priorities. Also, this piece is very puzzling. There is obviously some (to put it mildly) anger in there, probably ignited by some event in the writer's personal life. I hope she realizes that most people live in a world where decisions like this can be by couples together through a healthy discussion.

Kate Neal

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 7:27 p.m.

Honestly I think the point is that we all make our own decisions... man or woman. I am not going to let a man or another women tell me what to do. I know what is best for me and my family, those of you who are arguing and taking offense that this is anit-man are missing the whole point. How would you feel if I told you to stay home and raise children while I worked? Or that I was going to stay home and you had to get a second job and there was no discussion involved and neither was what you wanted to do. The point is, we all make decisions together and what is best for ourselves and families. People need to be a little bit more loving towards each other and their life styles.

Mary Talieh

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 7:27 p.m.

This is silly. It implies that all over this nation, women are allowing themselves to be pushed around by bullies and that those bullies are men. If this is true, I would like to see some statistical evidence. I don't know why I bother reading the Ann Arbor News.

Linda

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 7:22 p.m.

The "Mommy Wars" are so very tiresome. No winners in this argument, because everyone has to do what works for their families and there is no one-size-fits-all solution. I wish we could stop talking about this and instead band together to talk about ways to make things better for ALL parents and kids.

Halter

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 7:21 p.m.

Did I miss something????? I went to bed in 2012 and woke up in 1972....

Hot Sam

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 5:02 p.m.

Let's make a deal...I won't tell you what to do, and you won't tell me I have to pay for it...

sh1

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 4:52 p.m.

All the anti-women messages here do well to prove the author's point.

genetracy

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 4:52 p.m.

Ann Arbor is the only city I have been to where I angered a woman for holding a door open for her.

Bells Defranco

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 4:19 p.m.

Excellent points Shepard145 - decades of liberal indoctrination at colleges, plus the national liberal media has had a big impact. All we can do is enjoy life as it is, and vote. It's still a great country, though it's currently falling apart in a massive way under Obama. To those young people out there thinking of marriage, take care of your existing families - your parents, brothers and sisters. That's the most important contract of all.

Lovaduck

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 4:17 p.m.

This is one of the most sexist columns I ever have seen in print. According to this logic, African-Americans can't tell Caucasians anything, and vice versa. Gays cannot comment on straight behavior, and vice versa. If an Asian person has a custom I don't care for or consider immoral I have (since I'm not Asian) nothing to say. Jews cannot tell Gentiles what to do and vice versa. Her position regarding men and women is pure sexism and does nothing to promote any sort of mutual understanding or help in resolving the conflicts we ALL need in today's complex society.

shepard145

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 3:52 p.m.

Well said. It's a combination of the failure of the feminist experiment still working to dismantle the American nuclear family (and subsequent ongoing attacks in every area of popular culture) and failure to adopt guiding principals such as religion that lend meaning and direction to life. Add to that the corrosive impact of vote buying schemes like the massive democrat social engineering that poured billions into Detroit over generations with nothing to show for it but institutionalized poverty, crime and unemployment. On an individual level, one answer is to enjoy women raised in other countries, who do not have the social baggage dumped on them by US media and educational systems. I for one have been DONE with US chicks for a long time and could not be happier. Good luck to all you guys still trying to "make it work" with an American chick, LOL

Bells Defranco

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 3:21 p.m.

It's a good time in America to be single and stay single, especially if you are a male. All you guys out there engaged to Annarborite feminists, here's what you can likely expect; 3 to 10 years of ups and downs, then a stressful divorce where she gets half and you get to visit your kids every other weekend. America has been losing its soul for decades now, in large part due to lack of religion. Men are now considered by many women to be nothing but sperm donors. I do see marriages that work out there, but the vast majority of people I know are divorced at least once. I think that for many, the stress that comes with it is worth it. But with attitudes like the one here, can you see why it's getting to the point of marriage not being worth it? This to me is the real issue. There's this overall sense of hostility toward men today. And marriage is being eroded.

genetracy

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 3:18 p.m.

"I am woman, hear me roar, in numbers too big to ignore....." - Helen Reddy, 1970's social commentator

Diagenes

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 2:19 p.m.

Michele, Since you object to men telling women what to do with their bodies, do you favor the legalization of prostitution? How about late term abortion? We have societal mores for a reason. Its because they work for the good of society over thousands of years. We need to go back to what has been successful. Women should have the same right as a man to pursue her life goals and aspirations. A woman should receive the same compensation for the same work as a man. Women should have the same political and economic freedom as men. But like it or not men and women are different. One of the worst trends in society is the defeminization of women and the feminization of men. A strong family unit with a married man and woman is the best social program. Working together in mutual respect can solve alot of our social ills. The he vs. she mentality is a deflection from the real issues in our country.

RunsWithScissors

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 1:43 p.m.

Oooo wee! This column is like dropping a match in a gas tank. The more tolerant our society appears to be the more intolerant we've become.

Ron Granger

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 1:05 p.m.

"Men are not qualified in the area of what women want or need so they need to stay out of the decisions that so greatly impact our lives." What about parallel parking? Does that include parallel parking?

A2comments

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 12:48 p.m.

Had not read Tom's letter until I saw Michele's, went back and read it. Clearly she misunderstood his letter. As far as the issue of Mrs. Romney, Mitt cited her as his counselor regarding the economic needs of women. Given that she has been a homemaker in a very wealthy family, Ms. Rosen was badly trying to make the point that Mrs. Romney has no experience to give her that understanding. She has not had economic needs, except for a car garage in one of her homes. Mitt Romney is not in touch with everyday America. Maybe Obama isn't either, but he is a lot closer. Either way, in today's politics, Congress stops any President from being effective.

sh1

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 11:47 a.m.

So many sensitive men here overreacting about their hurt feelings. Must be their time of the month.

Craig Lounsbury

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 11:43 a.m.

My wife told me to mow the lawn and take out the trash. Now that I've been enlightened I told her to back off and focus on her own issues. I don't recommend it, its not going so well. :( Maybe I should get a lawyer and sue the person who gave me the idea.

FredMax

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 5:55 a.m.

Attention all men! Attention all men! Our plan has been discovered. Meet at same time and place as last week to come up with a new plan for controlling women.

Felicia

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 4:10 a.m.

Bravo Michele!

Michael K.

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 2:28 a.m.

Ha, you guys are funny! It's called "mansplaining." As if women owed you for anything.

shepard145

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 1:09 a.m.

It is completely natural and appropriate for women to crave the approval, structure, guidance and direction that real men provide them. Those women studies majors rolling out of college who think they want some milk sop liberal "equal" for a husband usually learn the hard way years later that they've been scammed. ...they finally figure out that their "mates" are merely weak and/or lazy and have artfully dumped the stress of providing for the family on their shoulders....and then they hate them for it. LOL

shepard145

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 12:45 a.m.

Further, you and all women should be grateful to the men of this and past generations who promoted equality for women, parted with their peers and supported the kind of education that you have enjoyed in this country. Such freedom of destiny for women is a gift in a world with many nations with cultures far older then ours that considers educating women unnecessary or even offensive. For all you obama lovers who agree with our incompetent president that the US should cut and run from Afghanistan before our Armed Forces recommend, the education of women there is likely one of the first things TO GO. American women should thank God every day for all you have been granted in the freest country on earth.

shepard145

Sat, Apr 21, 2012 : 12:35 a.m.

A "Senior Partner in a Law Firm (of one?)". The sad fact is that because democrats can't run on their record of massive failure, they must turn to divisive rhetoric as a tool the press will then use to distract voters from the facts. Therefore we will see more of phony "gender politics" as democrats attempt to divide Americans along gender, race, income, demographic, religious and age lines. We've just starting to see the wild lies from democrats about the hard working Americans who dare to run for political office this year. It is also worth noting that this would be an unworkable strategy without the enthusiastic support from our massively corrupt national media that is little more then a mouth piece for this failed government - see Russian Pravda. How many of you know that Harry Reid is a Mormon or read about how the leftist press has expressed concern about HIS religion? As far as whose tell who what to do, you presume a gender division and independence of thought and interests that simply does not exist in the real world except at the irrelevant extreme margins.

Dog Guy

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 10:51 p.m.

There is even more need to read the manufacturer's manual on maintaining marital relationships now that so many couples are not and their children are not really.

Chimay

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 10:23 p.m.

Yikes. The problem is worse than I thought - I am disturbed by the trend in voting on these comments. While this editorial has a tone that is not really conducive to dialog, its point is valid. Stop putting legislation on the table that singles out specific groups of people. Imagine how it feels to be a woman and know that a presidential candidate can't take an affirmative position on the Ledbetter Act; that a governor signed the repeal of a state's fair pay act, sending a clear message that the same work done by a woman is not as valuable as a man's; that contraceptives will now cost you hundreds of dollars per year because some male virgin wearing a funny hat thinks otherwise (on a salary that is, on average, 77% lower than the guy in the cubicle next to you!); that legislators in another state made it legal for doctors to mislead and even LIE to a woman about birth defects found in the baby she is carrying; etc, etc. So, I understand why Ms. Kelly is angry. It is really beyond me why politicians are so damned interested in my body and why many of them believe that equal pay for equal work is bad for the economy/business. Telling politicians to back off is the right message.

Machine

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 10:13 p.m.

I've had women telling me what I should and shouldn't do my entire life. I think it works both ways...

Harry

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 8:04 p.m.

It so funny how the liberals at A2 news don't want you to talk about how bad abortions are. I view abortions like I do suicides. Suicide is illegal because if you are hurting yourself you must not be in the right capacity so you need help. Same with abortion. Common sense says taking a life whether its in your body or out is not right. I hope I put it nicely enough for everyone.

A2James

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6:59 p.m.

"Men are not qualified in what women want or need..." Hahaha..and as a stereotypical man, I'm now smiling and tuning out :)

michigancitizen

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6:53 p.m.

I'm sorry you seem to have taken Mr. Watkins article so personally. It seemed to me that he was saying that all women should be respected for their life choices and hard work, in both a career and in parenting. The root of the "mommy wars" is our own guilt about our choices. It has nothing to do with men.

Pickforddick

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6:47 p.m.

Who really Cares?

Fatkitty

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6:41 p.m.

"This disturbing position that men are going to start telling us what choices we have and decisions regarding our bodies, homes or opportunities will have dismal results." START telling us? Where have you been? They've BEEN telling us what to do for thousands of years! It's natural, like day and night. But I don't have to listen unless I choose to. And I walked away from the last one who tried to control every spare minute I have.

DonBee

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6:38 p.m.

No adult human should tell or force another rational adult human from doing anything. How ever stopping someone from suicide, a major crime or other non-rational act should be the responsibility of any rational adult human. Everyone should respect the choices others make. Most people who have a choice pick the path that has the highest value to their internal understanding of their world.

dotdash

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6:35 p.m.

It seems to me we are mixing up two very different things. Most women have a great deal of power in their personal relationships with husbands, fathers, sons, etc. and for the most part, husbands, fathers, and sons respect the women in their personal lives. The ironic thing is that we don't have a great deal of power in our political relationships. It's our politicians and other leaders who need to be told to back off -- or at least step back, acknowledge that they may not understand someone else's perspective, and not presume to know best. We need to support women politicians and leaders ourselves. I just hate to hear women rip into either Hillary Clinton or Condi Rice. Let's set the example for men by respecting the leaders among us. Then maybe we'll have more.

HaeJee

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 6 p.m.

I couldn't have said it better if I tried. My husband and I also put ourselves through graduate school, while raising our 4 children AND I worked full-time. I get very tired of hearing men and their opinions on what I should be allowed to do with my mind and body. If we are suppose too have equal rights, then why do I feel as if women are supposed to act as if we are fortunate that conservative men allow us these rights? Thank you to the writer of this opinion article. It is way past due for someone to voice this opinion for women. @Geewhiz – why do you think so MANY men believe their advice should matter? Unless I am married to you, your advice means nothing. Here is a word of "advice" to men, unless you are asked - assume we don't care about your opinions on women's rights.

Major

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:53 p.m.

I agree with your core statement. Yet the political undertones of both "letters" has me shaking my head as I am not fooled. So tired of "he said she said", left vs right. Must everything be black or white, red or blue. Now I wonder is it even PC for me to say such things.

ToddBrown

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:50 p.m.

I'm confused...Hilary Rosen, a woman, makes the comment. Watkins, a man, supports equality and choice for women, yet men are the target of this opinion letter?

aamom

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:49 p.m.

I can tell you're angry, but I'm not sure who it's directed at. Men, Tom's mother-in-law for saying she didn't get a paycheck, stay at home mothers, a little bit of all of those? As far as Tom's mother-in-law saying she didn't get paid, I think you missed the point. I'm sure you paid a nanny or daycare to help parent your children while you were at work or school (let's face it, whether we stay home or not, every adult we entrust our children with are helping in big and small ways to help parent/guide them.). So although you didn't receive a check for being a parent, you probably spent a large part of your other paycheck paying someone else to help you with your parenting responsibilities. I think Tom's mother-in-law was referring to that portion of the parenting work that she didn't get paid for as your nanny or daycare did. I would also guess that she didn't actually resent not being paid, she resented that her choice of work wasn't respected.

David Briegel

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:46 p.m.

Michelle, you are absolutely correct. It is your choice and yours alone. If you desire the opinion of another, you can always ask! And it is none of our business! Especially the evil big govt!!

Craig Lounsbury

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:37 p.m.

its a bit ironic that your rant is ultimately based on the quote of another woman, Hilary Rosen, who said that stay a stay at home mother never worked a day in her life.

GeeWhiz

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:27 p.m.

I think it is condescending for you to tell men to "back off". Men are not deciding for the women - men are simply providing advice, the decision is ultimately the womans!

ummsw

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:25 p.m.

Well said..Thank You!!

ferdcom

Fri, Apr 20, 2012 : 5:18 p.m.

So, you're qualified to tell men (and women) what they should or shouldn't do?